HoopLife Forums

The opportunity to talk about issues affecting Canadian basketball from coast-to-coast
 
HomeHome  CalendarCalendar  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  MemberlistMemberlist  UsergroupsUsergroups  RegisterRegister  Log in  

Share | 
 

 How do rankings compare?

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
AuthorMessage
shaq



Posts : 36
Join date : 2009-11-16

PostSubject: How do rankings compare?   Wed Jan 18, 2012 7:43 pm

As the second set of rankings are about to come out I thought I would throw out a question.

What is the equivalent ranking place when jumping from classification to classification? If McCoy or SAC are ranked as first in 3A, how does that compare to a 4A ranking? I would suggest that a 1st place ranking in the lower classification is probably the equivalent of a 3rd place ranking in the higher classification. So to continue, the top 2A school would be ranked around the bottom of the top ten in 4A. The best 1A team would be near the bottom of HM.

Back to top Go down
View user profile
the-stalker



Posts : 27
Join date : 2011-12-14

PostSubject: shaq   Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:07 pm

Where did this come from Razz ....lol !! first off any year the comparison is obviously different Shocked ....and for the record you need to be aware of some teams that are already playing up a classification or 2 ...Raymond is a 1A class school but always plays up at the 4A level and doesnt pick their spots where others might move up and take a chance ...Cardston is also the same example with a little higher population ....Immanuel Christian is always looking for the competiton of higher tournaments ...some schools pick there spots ...afraid of losing games and effecting there rankings ... lets face it rankings are losing there appeal as at the end of day does nothing except help with promoting b ball and interest ...perhaps in numbering the final ranking for the provincial tourney but even then its a political nightmare .... the loudest usually wins .... lol..McCoy and SAC might be a middle top ten 4A ranking and Immanuel Christian might be an HM ....they also don't mind the better tournaments ...hard to compare unless these teams play more tourneys and gio head to head with 4A....just my opinions ..... Basketball bounce afro Sleep Rolling Eyes
Back to top Go down
View user profile
bballspirit



Posts : 129
Join date : 2009-11-24

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:48 pm

The rankings do carry weight as they are used to hand out wildcard berths for the provincial tournaments and ranking going into provincials.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
the-stalker



Posts : 27
Join date : 2011-12-14

PostSubject: rankings    Thu Jan 19, 2012 3:43 pm

wildcards are not determined by rankings , determined by who hosts the Provincials Basketball ...check last number of years... Very Happy afro Basketball
Back to top Go down
View user profile
shaq



Posts : 36
Join date : 2009-11-16

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Thu Jan 19, 2012 5:21 pm

If a 2A/3A team loses to a 4A team how does it affect their rankings, how about the other way around? If a 4A team that is ranked loses to a smaller school, how do the rankers view this? Do they ignore it? Do they weight the loss even more heavily because it is a smaller school? Someone posted a comment about McCoy playing in 4A tournaments. You can only play if you are invited. Sometimes these invites can take a while to earn. Do 4A schools not invite the likes of McCoy, SAC, Immanuel to tournaments because of the risk of a loss to a smaller classification school? Do larger schools pass on smaller school tournament invites for this reason?

Back to top Go down
View user profile
bballspirit



Posts : 129
Join date : 2009-11-24

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Thu Jan 19, 2012 6:07 pm

wildcard berths are handed to out zones with more teams in the top 15. You will notice that the north central zone rarely receives a wildcard spot because they never have teams ranked, whereas Edmonton will regularly receive 1 or 2 wildcard spots. The host does not get a wildcard berth they receive a host spot. Check the ASAA regs.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
HenryW



Posts : 27
Join date : 2011-11-08

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Thu Jan 19, 2012 6:21 pm

You are correct wildcard berths are determined by a points system based on rankings.

Not sure if you meant that the host school counts as a wildcard or that the host zone can't get a wildcard. But the host zone most definitely can get a wildcard. It has happened the last 2 years. When provincials were in the south they got 4 berths. 2 guaranteed 1 host and 1 wildcard berth. Last year Edmonton got 5 berths. 3 guaranteed 1 host and 1 wildcard.

The rule is there is a maximum of 5 berths per zone.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
hoopsnut



Posts : 20
Join date : 2010-12-19

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Thu Jan 19, 2012 6:38 pm

Seriously? The best 3A teams would be HM at the 4A level. Chestermere and Cochrane are ranked 1 and 2 this year and they would not be in the top 10 at the 4A level. Edmonton Christian (who is 3rd in 3A) would not be in the top 40 at the 4A level. Mccoy wouldn't be in the top 100 at the 4A level. The top 2A teams are worse than that. You have to remember that there are classifications for a reason. A 4A team has 3 times more students (and sometimes more than that) than a 3A team. In other words, take the best 4 players from a 3A team, multiply by 3 and then you have a 4A team.

Teams like Raymond are an anomaly for a variety of reasons (basketball culture, town support, history of BB rivalry between the small towns, excellent coaching) and what they do down there as a 2A school is unbelievable!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Southfan



Posts : 152
Join date : 2009-11-22

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Thu Jan 19, 2012 9:21 pm

hoopsnut, you are a nut, McCoy would be in the top 3 in 4A this year, probably #2. They have 3 tall athletic girls who can shoot the 3 or go inside, a true point guard and pressure you the whole game. They are a very good team! you do not beat that many good 4A teams on being lucky!!!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Cash9



Posts : 16
Join date : 2011-12-25

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Fri Jan 20, 2012 12:04 am

i think some clarification is needed for some between considering boys teams or girls teams in this discussion. it is very different between the two at the high school level when looking at smaller tiered schools competing against higher tiered schools.

when considering mccoy and st albert as girls programs, they can compete against most top 4A programs. as both programs are #1 and #2 at 3A. when considering the boys programs for mccoy and st albert which are #6 and #8 in 3A rankings, they wouldn't crack the top 50 in 4A.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
12321



Posts : 386
Join date : 2011-06-26

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:45 am

I haven't seen a lot of the top 10 4A schools from Edmonton and Calgary but Cochrane is way, way better than LCI ranked at #10 and would probably beat Cardston ranked at #5 fairly easily. I don't know about Chestermere but I know they beat Cochrane so I'd say both teams would be at the top of the 4A rankings. Don't underestimate 3A teams this year.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
bballspirit



Posts : 129
Join date : 2009-11-24

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Fri Jan 20, 2012 10:05 am

Chestermere barely beat Sturgeon Comp, which is a decent but currently unranked 4A school. So I doubt they would easily beat Cardston or LCI. Not saying they are not a decent team but to say they would easily beat these ranked school is crazy. The top 4A schools can't beat each other easily.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
12321



Posts : 386
Join date : 2011-06-26

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Fri Jan 20, 2012 10:22 am

Harry Ainlay beat Cardston fairly easily (20+ points?) and destroyed HM Strathcona by 50. Bishop OByrne beat #6 Paul Kane by 30 and Bishop Grandin beat Paul Kane by 20.

There are teams that are just that much better than the rest. Some 3A teams just need the experience of playing 4A teams on a regular basis. They might lose at first but as long as they have the athletes and the coaching they'll rise to the competition level. There are 3A teams that are not ranked or even HM that are capable of beating top 10 4A teams right now.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
bballspirit



Posts : 129
Join date : 2009-11-24

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Fri Jan 20, 2012 11:49 am

Any team can pull off an upset from time to time and some teams may have an off game, as you have indicated in your scores. But for an honourable mention 3A school to knock off a ranked 4A school, the 4A school would need to play poorly and the 3A would need to play exceptional. PK played one of their worst games of the year against SACHS and still won by 16. Yes can 3A schools beat 4A's, of course, and the top 3A schools are probably close to the top 4A, but the bottom ranked 3a schools are not , as one would expect given the population differential.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Southfan



Posts : 152
Join date : 2009-11-22

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Fri Jan 20, 2012 12:15 pm

12321
You are so full of s---, you do not have a clue what you are talking about!!!! geek Bring on all of those great 3A teams! Raymond,Cardston, LCI, and CCH will all send you home with your tails between your legs!! confused If they are so great move up to 4A and let your playing do the talking, that is all you got is talk!!!! lol!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
12321



Posts : 386
Join date : 2011-06-26

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:01 pm

I'll admit we've taken a couple big hits in league play this year to 4A teams and we've probably got more coming but we've also had a few competitive games that we could have won. By the end of the year with some more experience, I think our unranked 3A team will beat a currently ranked 4A team. I'll be sure to let you know when we do.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
hoopsnut



Posts : 20
Join date : 2010-12-19

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Fri Jan 20, 2012 2:55 pm

Southfan: sorry I was strictly speaking about boys basketball this year. I Have no clue how the girls stack up.

I agree with the comment that if the 3As think they can be a contender at 4A, then move up to 4A the way some of the south teams do.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
2guard14



Posts : 25
Join date : 2010-02-23

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:01 pm

Two things: Firstly, you can't just go from 3A to 4A or 2A to 3A. It's a far more complicated process than that.

Secondly absolutely, the best 3A teams and even 2A teams can run with a lot of good 4A teams. For example, Ponoka has finished 3rd at the Tri-Prov at Ainley twice. THe year Bert Church (4A then) went to the semi's at provincials, they were beaten by 3A Springbank twice during the season. I watched Edmonton Christian (2A) finish 3rd in cities (taking Ainley to the wire) a few years ago. 2A Picture Butte was the second best team at the Reb tournament three or four years back (when Kelly Olynik was playing for South Kamloops). The three 4A teams in Red Deer historically have never dominated the 3A Central Zone they play in.

Just sayin. A lot of times, in Alberta at least, a couple of blue chip players is all it takes to put a small school on par with a big school with average talent.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Southfan



Posts : 152
Join date : 2009-11-22

PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:55 pm

hoopnut,
ya, we were talking two different things!!! agree.

As to all of this 4A, 3A,2A stuff!! Ya there are isolated times that a 3A or 2A team can play with ranked 4A teams.
So what!, Raymond and Cardston have done it year in and year out and that is why they play 4A and not play 3A and 2A and put a butt whooping on you year after year,it is simple to play up!!, so if you are that good come a running and play up or shut up!!!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
canuck



Posts : 61
Join date : 2009-11-10
Location : Alberta

PostSubject: divisions   Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:00 am

any given year a lower division team will have, on average, a 'better' team than a higher division (unless your catholic central, then you deserve honourable mention every year - that's another tirade!), but can they pull it off year after year - outside of southern alberta the answer seems to be no.

This is a good year to see it though, outside of Harry Ainley, Edmonton seems pretty weak (so far, perhaps teams will get more competitive as the year goes on) leaving room for teams like Chestermere and Cochrane who seem to be steamrolling south-central teams and so appear strong compared to 4A teams (springbank and bert church). Chestermere is coming off several successful years (back to back 3A titles followed by a weaker year and back with a strong team this year). Any given tournament, Cochrane or Chestermere could probably compete with most of the top 4A teams. Tough to compare when the 4A teams their playing are struggling.

In the south, LCI seemed to be off to a good start with a tight game against Harry Ainley but have since lost to Raymond so it should be a great battle down there. Can Cardston finally put it together and get past their nemesis comets or will Magrath sneak in and compete? Maybe Pasquotti will shut me up by winning the south (I'd be good with that, but I'll believe it when I see it). lol!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: How do rankings compare?   Today at 5:49 am

Back to top Go down
 
How do rankings compare?
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» Rankings AAA
» Rankings HQ
» Senior Boys Rankings?
» 3A final rankings
» Canadian Top 25 Pre-Season High School Rankings - North Pole Hoops

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
HoopLife Forums :: High School :: Alberta-
Jump to: