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 LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action

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hoopfan



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:37 pm

Most ball players and coaches in the Kelowna area are very aware of why this player ended up at St Georges..... it was a hot conversation why he was not at KSS in Sept. Not a rumour, fact is , he was recruited while at AllBAll, just like the other player.
Its interesting to see the excuses come out from all the IND supporters. Just not willing to accept that the IND schools uses financial carrot to bring over players. no matter how you dress it up, its wrong.
[/quote]

ATTENTION BALLERS! Come play for public school, our government will pay for your education. Independent school will not be allowed to assist you financially even though you are a well balanced academic athlete, if you are offered a scholarship you are not allow to play in the IND school.

Public school has no entrance exam; they don’t care what your grades are nor your post secondary education, you don’t have to commit to your academic curriculums where IND school always have someone looks over your shoulder. Don’t worry, just play ball, your parent won’t be able to find out how you do in class because they are not getting a report card.

Better yet, play in the LM zone school; they have executives to make sure you don’t compete with the top ranked IND school by not letting them play, and if someone protests they have rules to expel them.

Oh one more thing, teachers, coaches, and parents of IND schools are tax payers too.
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Machoops



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:24 pm

Why can't the Independent just run a league of their own, like actually play each other, have a league championship and then just have them branch off to their respective Lower Mainland tiers similar to the public schools. Not very familiar with how the LMISSAA work but teams like WPGA, St.Johns, St.Pats, Notre Dame, STM, VC, Saints can all play each other, have playoffs etc...

hoopfan...maybe that's why the VSSAA don't want to have the independents in the league, there's obviously a difference in standards and expectations right??



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Fox2030



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:26 pm

Mark Scott wrote:
Fox2030 wrote:
sunnyok wrote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Can anyone explain how a top grade 9 player from Dr. Knox(Kelowna) spends the summer playing club ball on the coast, then he ends up enrolling at St George for his Gr 10 year. That would be a huge financial commitment on any family.


I cut out the first part of the post as it was quite long. To answer your question; the player originally from Knox actually played for all ball academy that is run by St. Georges. His dad was offered a job by the all ball/ st georges coaches, and help with moving expenses so the family could move to the LM. I was told that Guy knows how to skirt the BC school sports rules and it would not be a problem. They also offered another all ball player a similar deal.

I love a good rumour, especially a second hand one.....

Stuff about me dating Kim Kardashian - I have no idea where that came from and all these other rumors. I don't think I'm that type.
Jeremy Lin


Answer the question Mark; for what job did the Kelowna family move to the LM for? You know the answer to this. You seem to have a problem with sanctions against the Ind LM teams and that the public schools are being unfair and then this happens. Give your head a shake, there is a history here. There are public school that have also violated BC school sports policies also, but I do not hear them whining when sanctions are imposed against them.

On another note;
Thanks for all you do Ebe for not only Palmer kids, but for all of the kids in BC that are Provincial team players. I know that you have discouraged Provincial team players from transferring to your school because of ethics. Too bad people can not appreciate the volounteers that get things done for love of the game. Hopefully one day coaches will realize the damage they are doing to their program when they or people associated with their programs recruit kids.
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Mark Scott



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:58 pm

Fox2030 wrote:
Mark Scott wrote:
Fox2030 wrote:
sunnyok wrote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Can anyone explain how a top grade 9 player from Dr. Knox(Kelowna) spends the summer playing club ball on the coast, then he ends up enrolling at St George for his Gr 10 year. That would be a huge financial commitment on any family.


I cut out the first part of the post as it was quite long. To answer your question; the player originally from Knox actually played for all ball academy that is run by St. Georges. His dad was offered a job by the all ball/ st georges coaches, and help with moving expenses so the family could move to the LM. I was told that Guy knows how to skirt the BC school sports rules and it would not be a problem. They also offered another all ball player a similar deal.

I love a good rumour, especially a second hand one.....

Stuff about me dating Kim Kardashian - I have no idea where that came from and all these other rumors. I don't think I'm that type.
Jeremy Lin


Answer the question Mark; for what job did the Kelowna family move to the LM for? You know the answer to this. You seem to have a problem with sanctions against the Ind LM teams and that the public schools are being unfair and then this happens. Give your head a shake, there is a history here. There are public school that have also violated BC school sports policies also, but I do not hear them whining when sanctions are imposed against them.

On another note;
Thanks for all you do Ebe for not only Palmer kids, but for all of the kids in BC that are Provincial team players. I know that you have discouraged Provincial team players from transferring to your school because of ethics. Too bad people can not appreciate the volounteers that get things done for love of the game. Hopefully one day coaches will realize the damage they are doing to their program when they or people associated with their programs recruit kids.

Fox2030, I have no idea about the family's personal job history or financial situation. All I know is that the family now lives near Saints and apparently they did not like the program they were in. Families move to better their situation all the time, especially for their children. They do it for lots of reasons. The kid from Regina in gr 9 moved to Yale this year (where is your outrage?), and I am sure they are saying nice things about that in Regina. A top player moved to Burnaby South this year. A kid moved a long distance to go to Walnut Grove - and was penalized because his family didn't move too (now that is an outrage). Last year's AAA MVP transferred to Palmer. I do not begrudge those moves, nor do I claim there was recruiting involved, but it is not a coincidence those schools have excellent basketball programs. Kids do not make moves to other schools blindly. Of course they know if there is a good program or a good coach, of course they talk to friends and their summer team coaches, but if you think there is recruiting then lodge an official complaint.

I also have no problems with sanctions for breaking rules - but the problem is not one-sided. So if you really have a concern, then prove it, stop spreading rumours here and blaming only one side.

Now I am going to watch some basketball games.....


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hoopfan



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Thu Mar 08, 2012 6:08 pm

Machoops wrote:
Why can't the Independent just run a league of their own, like actually play each other, have a league championship and then just have them branch off to their respective Lower Mainland tiers similar to the public schools. Not very familiar with how the LMISSAA work but teams like WPGA, St.Johns, St.Pats, Notre Dame, STM, VC, Saints can all play each other, have playoffs etc...

hoopfan...maybe that's why the VSSAA don't want to have the independents in the league, there's obviously a difference in standards and expectations right??




Playing sport-wise, no. Majority of basketball kids play clubs basketball, provincial teams etc post season. These teams are comprised of all walks of kids, private and public. Each club expects the same ethics/standard from every player playing in the same team. Why separate them?

If you see the recent scoring history of Vancouver City schools, their best team beat their other City teams by 40+ points average day in and day out. Where do you draw the line to justify additional zones/leagues?
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Pooch



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:22 am

Sunnyok: Not sure where you came up with a quote from me regarding the kid from Kelowna. I have made no comment on him and have no clue as to his or his family's situation.


Last edited by Pooch on Sat Mar 10, 2012 2:33 am; edited 1 time in total
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Downtown Freddie Brown



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:58 am

I recognize there are alot emotions and opinions regarding the private school debate.
But here's my question:

The rule states that if a 2nd place team (in a 2 team league) proves that it is top 3 in the lower mainland then it will receive a 2nd berth to the lower mainland tournament.

With St. George's and Vancouver College UNDEFEATED against other Lower Mainland teams this year, including double digit wins over Kitsilano (in January), multiple wins over Burnaby South, a win at Tupper, and a provincial #3 and #4 ranking at the time of the decision, right or wrong, they clearly demonstrated they were top 3 in the zone.

But it is clear that the Lower Mainland executive, which includes Mr. Eberhardt, Mr. Coutts, and Mrs. Coutts (voting Treasurer/Secretary) were not going to let that happen.

Had they acted as they should (in an unbiased leadership role), all this legal stuff would never have happened in the first place.

While I'm sure they are all hard working individuals, their obvious bias and personal agendas play a large part in the legal situation and black cloud currently over the Lower Mainland zone.

I do believe that there can be a resolution to this situation, but I honestly don't think it will happen until there are new members on the Executive.

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ebe



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Fri Mar 09, 2012 1:22 pm

Downtown Freddie Brown wrote:
I recognize there are alot emotions and opinions regarding the private school debate.
But here's my question:
The rule states that if a 2nd place team (in a 2 team league) proves that it is top 3 in the lower mainland then it will receive a 2nd berth to the lower mainland tournament.
With St. George's and Vancouver College UNDEFEATED against other Lower Mainland teams this year, including double digit wins over Kitsilano (in January), multiple wins over Burnaby South, a win at Tupper, and a provincial #3 and #4 ranking at the time of the decision, right or wrong, they clearly demonstrated they were top 3 in the zone.
But it is clear that the Lower Mainland executive, which includes Mr. Eberhardt, Mr. Coutts, and Mrs. Coutts (voting Treasurer/Secretary) were not going to let that happen.
Had they acted as they should (in an unbiased leadership role), all this legal stuff would never have happened in the first place.
While I'm sure they are all hard working individuals, their obvious bias and personal agendas play a large part in the legal situation and black cloud currently over the Lower Mainland zone.
I do believe that there can be a resolution to this situation, but I honestly don't think it will happen until there are new members on the Executive.

There seems to be much confusion about this particular point. The LM executive had nothing to do with the appeal made by the independent league. None of us had any say in that decision as a separate committee heard this appeal. This committee was comprised of people who had been approved by all four leagues and not one of them was a senior boys basketball coach in the lower mainland. The second and third levels of appeal also have nothing to do with us as they are comprised of directors and then governors from BC high school boys. You have to remember that they were turned down at the 2nd level of appeal as well by BC high school boys and this is the same group that upheld their appeal last year. The rule does not state that if they are in the top three they will receive a 2nd berth to the lower mainland tournament there are several other criteria. For the record the independent league had a very strong case and I have no problem with the decision the governors made to grant their appeal. While the top three is not the only criteria I totally agree that they had a strong case that they were in the top three. The problem at this point became how to include them in the zone playoffs. The independent schools put in NO proposal for how to adjust or adapt our playoffs if they were successfull in their appeal. We have had several meetings over the last year including a meeting of the entire membership and nothing was submitted, so with only a few days to get the draw done we had to go ahead with the play-in proposal as was done last year. Clearly this was not acceptable for St Georges so we then ended up with the legal action and thus the change in the playoff structure.
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Sportvictoria



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:46 pm

ebe wrote:
Downtown Freddie Brown wrote:
I recognize there are alot emotions and opinions regarding the private school debate.
But here's my question:
The rule states that if a 2nd place team (in a 2 team league) proves that it is top 3 in the lower mainland then it will receive a 2nd berth to the lower mainland tournament.
With St. George's and Vancouver College UNDEFEATED against other Lower Mainland teams this year, including double digit wins over Kitsilano (in January), multiple wins over Burnaby South, a win at Tupper, and a provincial #3 and #4 ranking at the time of the decision, right or wrong, they clearly demonstrated they were top 3 in the zone.
But it is clear that the Lower Mainland executive, which includes Mr. Eberhardt, Mr. Coutts, and Mrs. Coutts (voting Treasurer/Secretary) were not going to let that happen.
Had they acted as they should (in an unbiased leadership role), all this legal stuff would never have happened in the first place.
While I'm sure they are all hard working individuals, their obvious bias and personal agendas play a large part in the legal situation and black cloud currently over the Lower Mainland zone.
I do believe that there can be a resolution to this situation, but I honestly don't think it will happen until there are new members on the Executive.

There seems to be much confusion about this particular point. The LM executive had nothing to do with the appeal made by the independent league. None of us had any say in that decision as a separate committee heard this appeal. This committee was comprised of people who had been approved by all four leagues and not one of them was a senior boys basketball coach in the lower mainland. The second and third levels of appeal also have nothing to do with us as they are comprised of directors and then governors from BC high school boys. You have to remember that they were turned down at the 2nd level of appeal as well by BC high school boys and this is the same group that upheld their appeal last year. The rule does not state that if they are in the top three they will receive a 2nd berth to the lower mainland tournament there are several other criteria. For the record the independent league had a very strong case and I have no problem with the decision the governors made to grant their appeal. While the top three is not the only criteria I totally agree that they had a strong case that they were in the top three. The problem at this point became how to include them in the zone playoffs. The independent schools put in NO proposal for how to adjust or adapt our playoffs if they were successfull in their appeal. We have had several meetings over the last year including a meeting of the entire membership and nothing was submitted, so with only a few days to get the draw done we had to go ahead with the play-in proposal as was done last year. Clearly this was not acceptable for St Georges so we then ended up with the legal action and thus the change in the playoff structure.


Ebe... you should know better... please do not cloud this issue with the FACTS.

It's much easier for the 'true believers' to go on and on if they are able to blindly IGNORE THE FACTS of the situation so they can distort and twist things to suit their own purpose.


Lyle
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Fox2030



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Fri Mar 09, 2012 3:34 pm

Ebe keep in mind that you are appreciated by 99% of the population, or the silent majority. The hours you put in with RTC, the Palmer teams and Provincial teams as a VOLUNTEER are greatly appreciated. We have some very narrow minded people that are used to geting their way. The only improvement I see is a Provincial at large berth to the best placing team from each zone, but they missed qualifying for the Provincials. This would require an additional tournament with Ind #2, OK # 2, LM #6 and FV #8 with other zones participating if they have a strong zone. If the #1 team KSS was upset at Valleys would they have to sue st georges to qualify for Provincial? Just curious as I undersatnd Bunce did not play at all during the OK tournamant. Anyteam can have a bad game.
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Sim



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Fri Mar 09, 2012 5:39 pm

I think it would serve everybody if we had a play-in tourney or even an appointed wildcard team. I'm not sure if the logistics of a play-in would work out on short notice. Ie...the CIS automatically places the top ranked team not to qualify into the CIS Final 8. With the new system...The Valley, Mainland and Island would lose 2 Berths if Ind received 1 and 1 was reserved for the Wildcard.

As for everything else, all volunteers are appreciated. We all spend countless hours and financial expenses out of pocket on the kids. Ebe was my first real coach in the 80s but I shouldn't have to blindly agree with him. The majority of us want a fair system...even though the name calling and alleged propaganda from both sides would make most think otherwise. I'm glad some facts are coming out...hopefully resolutions will follow.
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Baseline



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Fri Mar 09, 2012 10:01 pm

Am I the only one who can't wait for the games to begin next week? As interesting as all this is, should we not let kids be kids and enjoy the game on the court?
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baller1000



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Sun Mar 11, 2012 4:06 pm

Sportvictoria wrote:
ebe wrote:
Downtown Freddie Brown wrote:
I recognize there are alot emotions and opinions regarding the private school debate.
But here's my question:
The rule states that if a 2nd place team (in a 2 team league) proves that it is top 3 in the lower mainland then it will receive a 2nd berth to the lower mainland tournament.
With St. George's and Vancouver College UNDEFEATED against other Lower Mainland teams this year, including double digit wins over Kitsilano (in January), multiple wins over Burnaby South, a win at Tupper, and a provincial #3 and #4 ranking at the time of the decision, right or wrong, they clearly demonstrated they were top 3 in the zone.
But it is clear that the Lower Mainland executive, which includes Mr. Eberhardt, Mr. Coutts, and Mrs. Coutts (voting Treasurer/Secretary) were not going to let that happen.
Had they acted as they should (in an unbiased leadership role), all this legal stuff would never have happened in the first place.
While I'm sure they are all hard working individuals, their obvious bias and personal agendas play a large part in the legal situation and black cloud currently over the Lower Mainland zone.
I do believe that there can be a resolution to this situation, but I honestly don't think it will happen until there are new members on the Executive.

There seems to be much confusion about this particular point. The LM executive had nothing to do with the appeal made by the independent league. None of us had any say in that decision as a separate committee heard this appeal. This committee was comprised of people who had been approved by all four leagues and not one of them was a senior boys basketball coach in the lower mainland. The second and third levels of appeal also have nothing to do with us as they are comprised of directors and then governors from BC high school boys. You have to remember that they were turned down at the 2nd level of appeal as well by BC high school boys and this is the same group that upheld their appeal last year. The rule does not state that if they are in the top three they will receive a 2nd berth to the lower mainland tournament there are several other criteria. For the record the independent league had a very strong case and I have no problem with the decision the governors made to grant their appeal. While the top three is not the only criteria I totally agree that they had a strong case that they were in the top three. The problem at this point became how to include them in the zone playoffs. The independent schools put in NO proposal for how to adjust or adapt our playoffs if they were successfull in their appeal. We have had several meetings over the last year including a meeting of the entire membership and nothing was submitted, so with only a few days to get the draw done we had to go ahead with the play-in proposal as was done last year. Clearly this was not acceptable for St Georges so we then ended up with the legal action and thus the change in the playoff structure.


Ebe... you should know better... please do not cloud this issue with the FACTS.

It's much easier for the 'true believers' to go on and on if they are able to blindly IGNORE THE FACTS of the situation so they can distort and twist things to suit their own purpose.


Lyle

Isn't it interesting how when facts like rules and regulations come out and that they exist for everyone, that the topic of the conversation is changed?

Being characterized as "true believers" belies the fact that there is a cabal of coaches at the LM and BCHSBBA that are behind all of this. Ebe's protestations to the contrary are refuted by looking no further than the new motions that he and Mr. Coutts have proposed for this years AGM. Their names are attached to all of them.

These motions, by themselves, reveal the contempt and animosity these individuals hold for VC and Saints.

It was they, that were behind the LM debacle. The proposed motions attempt to solidify once and for all, what they were trying to achieve earlier this month to exclude the independents.

Knowing that their proposals are unjust, inequitable and incapable of withstanding legal scrutiny, they have even taken the extraordinary step of attempting to take away the independents recourse to legal action to enforce what is right.

They are behaving like bullies. They want to change the rules to beat up on the smaller independents and take the extra step of tying their hands, so they can not fight back.

I am not a "true believer". I am a realist. Connect the dots. They all lead back to the same people. It is time for a change.
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hard2thehole



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Sun Mar 11, 2012 5:34 pm

LOL!!!! baller1000 aka Agent Mulder strikes again

I think maybe he is actually a robot sent from the future to repeat itself ad nauseum and annoy the crap out of everyone on this forum

PLEASE READ, its very relevant to your interests:

"the LM executive had nothing to do with the appeal made by the independent league. None of us had any say in that decision as a separate committee heard this appeal. This committee was comprised of people who had been approved by all four leagues and not one of them was a senior boys basketball coach in the lower mainland. The second and third levels of appeal also have nothing to do with us as they are comprised of directors and then governors from BC high school boys. You have to remember that they were turned down at the 2nd level of appeal as well by BC high school boys and this is the same group that upheld their appeal last year."

now your conspiracy theories are very cute, Agent Mulder, but let's be real here, it is obvious that this "cabal" you are talking about did not exist insofar as being the reason Sts and VC were denied the first few times.
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Pooch



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:46 pm

So you would support the ridiculous notion that Saints and VC were NOT in the top three in the zone? That a strong argument could NOT be made that they were?
Ludicrous.
Those that made the ruling were clearly influenced by things other than reality. I don't know to what extent Ebe and Coutts influenced them...did they help select the committee? However it happened, they made an incredibly biased decision...and at the BC level, the reaction of the LM Zone executive to last year's decision was obviously part of this year's.
No unbiased person could possibly have come to the conclusion they did.
Baller1000 seems to me to set the facts out very clearly and a conspiracy is very evident.
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Pooch



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:53 pm

One of the new proposals for the AGM is to move it to the provincial pro-d day.
Sounds nice...as stated, more coaches could attend. All public schools have that day off.
Can anyone tell me if the Independent schools get the same day off?
Being a believer in the conspiracy theory, I doubt if they do get that day off. Of course if that day is not one where the Independents could be expected to attend, I am sure those that made the proposed amendment never thought of that. Right.
Maybe I will be proven wrong on this one...I hope so...but it would sure fit with my theory.
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hard2thehole



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:55 am

Pooch wrote:
I don't know to what extent Ebe and Coutts influenced them...



Ok there Agent Scully.

You know what? You're absolutely right. You don't seem to know much of anything to be honest. So I'm not sure why you continue to commit libel against Ebes and Coutts like they've actually done something wrong when you have absolutely no proof of your allegations.

The first committee comprised of people who had nothing to do with the LM zone or senior boys basketball coaching. The other committees were the governors etc. Oh, but Ebes and Coutts probably paid them under the table to come to their decisions right? Threatened their families? Threatened their careers? LOL. you are a joke.
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Pooch



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:56 am

No answer to my question?
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pistol44



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:19 pm

To answer your question this is a Pro-D day for most if not all independants as well.

problem for many teacher coaches is that this is supposed to be a day for just that - Professional development not agm's
This is a big day for Pro D in many other subject areas (the reason we get paid). I realize most coaches will make this their priority but if all these coaches are going to be at the Super conference perhaps make the AGM part of the saturday. I have chosen to go to this conference as my pro d some years but in other years pressures from administation to improve other academic areas come in to play.
There is no perfect solution to get everyone there, but if it works out great.
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hoopster



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Tue Mar 13, 2012 12:07 am

Pooch wrote:
One of the new proposals for the AGM is to move it to the provincial pro-d day.
Sounds nice...as stated, more coaches could attend. All public schools have that day off.
Can anyone tell me if the Independent schools get the same day off?
Being a believer in the conspiracy theory, I doubt if they do get that day off. Of course if that day is not one where the Independents could be expected to attend, I am sure those that made the proposed amendment never thought of that. Right.
Maybe I will be proven wrong on this one...I hope so...but it would sure fit with my theory.

Pooch once again you are running off at the keyboard while your brain is turned off. Public school teachers do not get this day off, it is a day of Professional growth. The teachers do get options to attend a Provincial Pro-D day or at stay with in their district and attend a conference or workshop, but they must be accountable to their admin. An AGM would not be considered professional development, however as pistol 44 mentioned, it could be held on the Saturday so any coach could attend. It is likely more coaches from the Interior could also attend as they may attend the coaching workshops typically held on that week end. Unless there is a conspiracy to keep coaches from the interior from attending the AGM.

Please keep in mind pooch that most coaches are volunteering their time and deserve a lot of respect and appreciation for what they do.
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Lefon Jang



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Tue Mar 13, 2012 2:40 am

hoopster wrote:

Please keep in mind pooch that most coaches are volunteering their time and deserve a lot of respect and appreciation for what they do.
I totally agree with you but we’re talking about a small percentage of coaches at the LM that frequently have their names appeared in motions to exclude the Independent schools. The points that Baller1000 have made were not out of thin air, a lot of facts and patterns have emerged from the AGM Motions. Many of you have refused to see these facts and instead tried to put Baller1000 down by resorting to name calling, a tactic often used by bullies. It is time for a change. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Put your prejudice on Independent Schools aside; think about basketball at the highest level. We have to find a way for the top teams to compete.
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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Wed Mar 14, 2012 12:50 am

Well said Lefon.
Not sure where I said I didn't respect coaches. If I did I apologize. They do a great service to the kids they coach and to our game.
I also think I said the public schools get the day off...I didn't say the teachers do.
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coachb



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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Thu Mar 15, 2012 8:27 pm

I have been following this post for a while and took some time to read through the various "positions" that have been taken and offer the following as comments to consider. One of the common threads has been "a new approach is needed" the feeling being that the same old tired sides are being taken with the result being a line in the sand over which no one seems to be willing to move and a fear that students are going to lose out or be discriminated against from competing due to the school they have chosen to attend.

Points to consider in no particular order:
1. a common cry from both public and private school coaches is that parents and teenagers should have the right to chose freely and at any grade any school they want even if it is only on the basis of a "quality basketball/sports program" just as a parent might chose on the basis of an academic/religious/music/drama program.
2. private schools are offering financial incentives to students that public schools cannot therefore they gain a competitive advantage by being able to attract better athletes.
3. because public schools do not charge any fees they attract better athletes.
4. 'recruiting" (I use the term loosely here) is being done by public and private schools so don't discriminate against either. This is an intereting point given the first point which everyone needs to give some thought to and truly be open minded to.

These seem to be the main points that are rephrased over and over in different terms. There are red herring arguments such as "we need to do better at developing top basketball players, we lag behind other Provinces" why is that a red herring? Simple it is in the numbers Ontario as an example has 38.4% of the population of Canada, Quebec around 23.6% and BC 13.1%. Not to say we should not look at ways to improve but is it through the high school system and the creation of basketball power houses? This post is not about answering that question. Why you say?

Further points to consider:

1. High school basketball in BC is governed by a regulatory body called BC school sports. In its rules there are drawn up rules and regulations that limit transfers. Are they too strict or not strict enough? That is not the question here, the fact is there are rules that limit transfers. Therefore those that advocate free choice whether they be pro public or private ignore the spirit that governs the sport at the high school level in this Province.
2. Currently there seems to be the same teams year after year in the provincials and most if not all are not without a sniff of controversy or accusations of impropriety, some have been investigated and some have been found guilty and others not.
3. Threats of litigation do wonders to dissolve rules.
4. Athletes make winning teams it is why Universities and professional teams spend so much money on finding recruits.
5. The public school system is set up to be just that a public system, socialist in it roots some might say or others would say compassionate or fair. Giving equal oppourtunity to all. The private school system is not, there is segregation based on something, but it does provide a choice many want available.

This post is not offered as a solution but rather I hope as a way to look at some of the postions offered without attacking or insulting anyone. The one observation that should be highlighted is that both #1's stand in contradiction of each other and is where you will likely find the source of most of the tensions.
Attacking coaches who want to be able to compete and who may have "lost" players is not fair they still coach year after year, attacking parents who want the best for their sons/daughters is not fair either.

It does seem however that we are destined for either a rift to happen that would not be fair to all, the eventual collaspe of the high school system or the emergence of an elite system that does not benefit the majority of kids in high school.

The big question is what is the shape of the high school basketball you want to see?
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Join date : 2011-02-27

PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Thu Mar 15, 2012 9:41 pm

CoachB, you make too much sense. I ask that you be banned from this thread.
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PostSubject: Re: LM "AAA" playoffs are on hold due to potential legal action   Today at 10:55 am

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