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 Provincial Tittle

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snaked



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PostSubject: Sportvictoria   Mon Mar 08, 2010 12:29 am

Sportvictoria.com which is usually very good about everything "they" do basketball wise did not do the seedings well:

http://sportvictoria.com/basketball/BCBerthing/2010/2010BCDraw.htm

They say Tupper is 6, and they're LM3, yet they have Argyle, Howe Sound 1, as 11. How can Tupper be 6 if Byrne Creek is 8/9 when Byrne Creek is LM2.
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Underdog2010



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Mon Mar 08, 2010 3:09 am

snaked wrote:
Sportvictoria.com which is usually very good about everything "they" do basketball wise did not do the seedings well:

http://sportvictoria.com/basketball/BCBerthing/2010/2010BCDraw.htm

They say Tupper is 6, and they're LM3, yet they have Argyle, Howe Sound 1, as 11. How can Tupper be 6 if Byrne Creek is 8/9 when Byrne Creek is LM2.

You are correct snaked. I'm pretty sure Argyle was seeded #6 and Charles Tupper was seeded #11. However it really makes no difference as they play each other in the round of 16. Tupper must be pleased with this draw. They have to be the favourite against Argyle and are in the same position in the overall draw as if they did have the #6 seed.
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Shook



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Mon Mar 08, 2010 3:23 am

It would be awesome to see some of the AA boys team compete in this tournament (Palmer and Britt) If only they could play on the first day and play a challenge game to advance to the top 16! I honestly think they can compete with a number of these teams, maybe not a Yale or a VC etc. Palmer has beaten many rank teams as Britannia has as well. Just a thought. Comments?
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hoopdreams12



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Mon Mar 08, 2010 10:10 am

1. The seedings are fair. Yale and VC are clearly 1a and 1b. However, both will have a difficult road to the finals. Lots of parity this year in high school hoops. Having said that, I will predict the top four seeds (Yale, VC, WRCA and Pitt) will make it to the final four; with a VC - Yale final, with VC winning.

2. Has anyone else noticed that Vancouver College won the grade 8 and grade 10 provincial championships on Saturday? ...and they are ranked 2nd in the grade 9 provincials (to be played this week) and ranked 2nd in the grade 11/12 provincials. They have a legitimate shot at sweeping all four divisions. From what I understand, only a handful of schools have ever qualified for all four divisions within the same year, let alone come close to winning multiple championships in the same year.

3. As for the AA vs. AAA, both Palmer and Britt had a choice. In December/January, Palmer decided they were not nearly good enough to compete at the AAA level this year. Therefore, they tucked their tail between their legs and disappeared to AA. They thought they could win at the AA level since they had played quite well against ranked AAA teams. They were wrong. I am thrilled Britt beat them. Ebe was chasing a championship, albeit a second class championship.
In any given year, there are one or two teams from AA that could compete reasonably well against some ranked AAA teams. However, this was NOT the year! Even though AAA is relatively weak this year, the AA is even weaker. They would get hammered. It is such a massive jump to AAA. The smaller schools have no shot against a top 4 AAA team. It has only happened once in the past 25 years that a AA school was argued to be as good or better than the top AAA school.
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Shook



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Mon Mar 08, 2010 2:10 pm

Thanks for your comment hoopdreams12, much appreciated.

Vancouver College has absorbed so many players into their program. For instance, their grade 10 team consists of about 3 transfers (all provincial team members) Kyle Holden, Isiah Solomon, Cole Penman. When this team hits grade 12, they should win it all as they won juniors. Next year South or Palmer will probably take it.

As to your comment about AA, the top 4 in BC are clearly no match for them. I know Palmer lost to VC by 10 and Britt lost to Pitt Meadows by 4 but the next 12 seedings are a dog fight. Palmer has beaten and lost to Fox, lost to south by 4. They have beaten more rank teams but unfortunately, I cannot check right now. I'm not too sure about Brit beating any other rank teams expect for Tupper,

I also agree with your top 4, but I think Yale will beat VC in the finals. Yales bigs are better than VC's, I dont think they VC can match up well with them.
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hoopdreams12



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Mon Mar 08, 2010 3:52 pm

Agreed, VC has benefited from some transfers. But the core of their players at all levels have been there from day 1. Speaking of transfers, perhaps no schools have benefited more from transfers than Yale, Pitt and WRCA. Not surprisingly, those are the top 4 teams in the province. Not to mention that St. George's PAYS the tuitions (over $18,000/year) for several of their players - including Emerson Murray. At least the other schools do not PAY their players to play for them. It is ashame St. George's won last year with paid athletes.

As for the AA vs. AAA argument, it would be a nice perk for the winner of the AA tourney to qualify for the AAA tourney. I'd be in support of that, especially if it were a play-in game. However, in virtually every year, it would be a non-factor. We would not see the AA team playing on the Friday night. And really, that is all that matters: top 4 or bust.

Yale's bigs are very good. It will truly be a question of whether or not VC can handle the big(s) of Pitt, WRCA and Yale. I believe VC's tallest player is 6'4/6'5ish. But they are very deep in terms of talent in the backcourt.
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BBall Fan



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Mon Mar 08, 2010 5:03 pm

VC will be good to make it to the final, as they have a difficult schedule. Starting in the quarters, they would be playing in order, assuming games go along rankings :

Quarters - South Kam
Semis - WRCA

Don't forget that VC lost to WRCA earlier this year, in the HSBC tournament.

As for Yale, it is theirs to lose. Player for player, they are difficult to match up with. To beat Yale, you have to almost execute 100 % offensively, and then you still have to hope that Yale doesn't play well defensively.

The only games for Yale that have been close were early in the year against WRCA, the 2 games against Fox and the game against Tammy. The first game, Klassen sat out 10 min in the 2nd half, and Yale lost 75 - 71. The other 3 games, all Yale wins, the games were close because Yale did not play well defensively. However, they were still able to out-score their opponents.

Therein lies the problem for anyone playing Yale. Not counting their league games, because their league is extremely weak, but look at their offensive output in their other games.

exhibition vs WRCA - 71 pts
Big Ball tournament - 3 games - 97 pt avg
Burnaby South tournament - 3 games - 97 pt avg
Legal Beagle tournament - 3 games - 82 pt avg
Abby Snowball tournament - 3 games - 89 pt avg

Fraser Valley's - 5 games - 97 pt avg

That's an average of 91 points overall. What other team is going to outscore them ?
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snaked



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Mon Mar 08, 2010 6:46 pm

hoopdreams12 wrote:
Agreed, VC has benefited from some transfers. But the core of their players at all levels have been there from day 1. Speaking of transfers, perhaps no schools have benefited more from transfers than Yale, Pitt and WRCA. Not surprisingly, those are the top 4 teams in the province. Not to mention that St. George's PAYS the tuitions (over $18,000/year) for several of their players - including Emerson Murray. At least the other schools do not PAY their players to play for them. It is ashame St. George's won last year with paid athletes.

As for the AA vs. AAA argument, it would be a nice perk for the winner of the AA tourney to qualify for the AAA tourney. I'd be in support of that, especially if it were a play-in game. However, in virtually every year, it would be a non-factor. We would not see the AA team playing on the Friday night. And really, that is all that matters: top 4 or bust.

Yale's bigs are very good. It will truly be a question of whether or not VC can handle the big(s) of Pitt, WRCA and Yale. I believe VC's tallest player is 6'4/6'5ish. But they are very deep in terms of talent in the backcourt.

It's not just about the top 4. If the AA winner were allowed a play-in that would matter, and to be part of it. However, doing so would probably dilute the feelings of winning the championship at the AA level as they would then more than likely (Aldergrove the lone exception) not beat the top AAA and win. Then, instead of ending their season on a win with a banner...they'd be losing out.

I am definitely not in favour of this. If a team wants to play AAA because they think they can hang, great.

But, from your previous post, I don't understand why you have to cut AA down so much. How would you feel if you could hear the Americans comments about us after they play our provincial teams at Gonzaga and beat them? I mean, those are all the best players in our province on one team losing to high school teams not much bigger, and in some cases smaller, than the schools the provincial team players come from. I'm sure some of the Americans trash AAA ball or BC Ball and look on it the same way you do on AA...I'm sure they'd saying win a AAA banner is a second class championship.

Let's look at the top AAA teams this year, top 4, outside of Yale who I am not sure about, I know the other 3 recruit heavily. WRCA has the school population of A yet they're a perennial AAA power? Gimme a break, they've had recruiting scandals over the years. Van College - 2 or three players who were all at different schools last year are now going there, guys off provincial teams. Pitt - Big Mike was in Kelowna...then he plays prov team for Goulet, suddenly he's at Pitt. Not to mention the good players Ridge loses to Pitt and one from Thomas Haney this year. Put an asterisk beside these teams' names. If you are going to bash AA ball, at least take into account school sizes, recruiting/not recruiting, loyalties to actually staying at a school for the name on the front of the jersey, not running off to another school for its prestigious name or smooth-talking coach.

Plus, I heard some coaches who've been to AAAs and AAs say they felt much more welcomed at AAs, as if everyone actually wanted them to be there. Where at AAAs, it's an old boys club, and you're a nuisance there.
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Shook



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Tue Mar 09, 2010 4:27 am

You are absolutely right snaked, I agree with every point you made. I know for a fact that Brittania has no recruits and were all in the district of the school. For Palmer, Vijay Dhillon went to Palmer from Burnett. But we have to live with these transfers... My point is that a lot of people have no respect for AA basketball and lets be honest, nobody knew anything about the AA's until Palmer decided to go down. Yes I know, some AA teams are very weak but there are strong AA programs. We need to improve at all levels in Basketball to become noticed as a province.
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Baseline



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Wed Mar 10, 2010 1:33 am

Seedings are fair and really don't see any major upsets along the way but both Yale and VC have some tough games in front of them. Yale - VC final with Yale taking their second title. Klassen MOP.
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coachb



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Wed Mar 10, 2010 2:38 pm

The road to the finals is not easy for any team. Seedings do look fair. Seems this year it is Yale's to lose. They cannot afford to take any team lightly, it seemed like the reason why Fox took them into overtime was they never took them seriously.
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truth



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Sun Mar 14, 2010 7:40 pm

Shook and Snaked have made several statements concerning the role of transfer and recruited players at VC. Snaked going so far as to say, that of the top 4 AAA teams, he knows they recruit heavily.

I know that facts are often hard to come by on this forum and wish more posters could actually stick to them.

Here is a link to VC's basketball rosters in 2007. In 2007 the Grade 8 team, now in Grade 11, won provincials. The Grade 9 team, now in Grade 12, came in third.

http://vc.bc.ca/student_activities/sports/BballRoster.htm

Going over the 2007 rosters and comparing them to VC's current senior roster, you will see that Thiel is the only transfer. He joined VC in grade 10 last year when the same group that won provincials as Grade 8's won them again as grade 10's. All of the other players on the current senior roster can be found on the 2007 grade 8 and 9 teams. They have all been at VC since Grade 8. Some, since grade 1!

This makes it hard to understand the claims that VC's success is built on recruits or transfers. The achievement of these players and coaches should not be diminished by unsupported offhand allegations.
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BBall Fan



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PostSubject: Is there going to be any close games ?   Wed Mar 17, 2010 1:55 pm

This is getting quite boring to watch, none of the games so far has even been close at halftime.

Watching Pitt vs Bby Sth right now, and even this game is headed to a blowout. Almost halftime and Pitt is up by 17.

Grove was able to keep it to 16 against WRCA, but still, I hope there are some exciting games still to come.
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okanaganbball



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Sun Mar 21, 2010 1:02 am

Congrats to the Yale Lions and the WRCA Warriors on an exciting final. A very defensively-minded game, and a treat to watch IMO.

A huge CONGRATULATIONS to Yale on winning it all and clawing back from being down for most of the game. Awesome work boys.
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Wintergreen



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PostSubject: Ugly game at the Agrodome   Sun Mar 21, 2010 1:40 am

"A treat to watch"? A defensive minded game?

It might have been the porest played final in the 65 year history of the tournament. Yale shot 17 of 50 on two point attempts and 0 for 12 from 3's as well as 15 of 36 from the foul line. White Rock was worse going 10 of 38 from two point land and a horrible 4 of 35 from 3's.

The kids all tried really hard but that was one ugly basketball game folks.
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okanaganbball



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Sun Mar 21, 2010 1:47 am

Wintergreen wrote:
"A treat to watch"? A defensive minded game?

It might have been the porest played final in the 65 year history of the tournament. Yale shot 17 of 50 on two point attempts and 0 for 12 from 3's as well as 15 of 36 from the foul line. White Rock was worse going 10 of 38 from two point land and a horrible 4 of 35 from 3's.

The kids all tried really hard but that was one ugly basketball game folks.

Yes, you quoted me correctly.

I am sorry a close final game is not exciting or fun to watch for you. I guess you enjoy the NBA where they play no defense and the scoring is through the roof? That's fun.

Last I'll say on the matter, yes they came to compete and it was fun to watch.
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BBall Fan



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Sun Mar 21, 2010 2:02 am

Well, I have to agree with .... both Wintergreen and okanaganbball.

Yes, it was a poorly played game, but part of that would be the defensive intensity shown by both teams. Yale being held to 18 points in the first half, I doubt there were many games where they didn't have more than that in a quarter, let alone a half. As for WRCA only scoring 11 in the entire second half, again, a combination of really tough defense, compounded by poor shooting.

As many shots as Yale missed in the first half, WRCA missed even more in the 2nd half. So, yes, you both are correct. However, I especially have to agree with okanaganbball, the game was exciting from start to finish, because of the fact that you just knew that Yale was going to make a run to get back into the game. And we all saw how nerves can play a part in the outcome, I don't think any of these kids was really calm tonight. Remember, they are still kids.

So, congrats to both teams for probably one of the most exciting games. Also, a big congrats to both schools for the solid fan support shown by both, it really makes it a lot of fun to see. The noise that was going on in the Dome, even 10 minutes before tipoff, you knew it was going to be a fun night, no matter who won or lost.
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okanaganbball



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Sun Mar 21, 2010 2:25 am

Look at these stats:

Quote :
The Yale defence did an incredible job by holding the Warriors to just 11 points in the second half.
In fact, the Lions didn't allow WRCA a field goal for a span of some eight minutes in the fourth quarter, a span in which Yale went on a game-turning 11-1 run.

I don't know Al Friesen as a coach that well, and from what I've seen he does yell a lot when the play is going. I really liked this quote from Howard Tsumura though:

Quote :
"Jordan was scared," Friesen said of his Grade 11 guard Jordan Blackman. "Finally, I called a time out just to tell him that I loved him,and that he just had to go out and play. He had tears. He told me he was trying. I just told him to not worry about failing."
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TheReturnOfWhiteChocolate



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Sun Mar 21, 2010 4:47 am

WOW, Eli Mara is horrible. Honestly, I don't think I've ever seen anyone so over-hyped.

Tyrell is the only one of the 3 brothers that actually deserved the hype they got.
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bball_6319



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Sun Mar 21, 2010 12:07 pm

TheReturnOfWhiteChocolate wrote:
WOW, Eli Mara is horrible. Honestly, I don't think I've ever seen anyone so over-hyped.

Tyrell is the only one of the 3 brothers that actually deserved the hype they got.

Add Nakai Lukyen to that as well - I don't see how he was even named as a third team all star. He is way over-hyped and will he be changing schools now that Yale has shot their wad this year?
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#10



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Sun Mar 21, 2010 3:32 pm

TheReturnOfWhiteChocolate wrote:
WOW, Eli Mara is horrible. Honestly, I don't think I've ever seen anyone so over-hyped..

Definitely didn't have his best game yesterday. So much for doing what he does best, he had a very poor 4th quarter.

It obviously wasn't the most entertaining game but congratulations to Yale on winning the whole thing.
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TheReturnOfWhiteChocolate



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Sun Mar 21, 2010 3:42 pm

#10 wrote:
TheReturnOfWhiteChocolate wrote:
WOW, Eli Mara is horrible. Honestly, I don't think I've ever seen anyone so over-hyped..

Definitely didn't have his best game yesterday. So much for doing what he does best, he had a very poor 4th quarter.

It obviously wasn't the most entertaining game but congratulations to Yale on winning the whole thing.

Yesterday? Look at his other provincial games? He is HORRIBLE. And I've seen Nikai play before which is why he comes as no surprise. Only thing he is good for is his athleticism. He can rebound, steal, and block. Offensive skill is horrible.
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#10



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Sun Mar 21, 2010 4:35 pm

TheReturnOfWhiteChocolate wrote:
#10 wrote:
TheReturnOfWhiteChocolate wrote:
WOW, Eli Mara is horrible. Honestly, I don't think I've ever seen anyone so over-hyped..

Definitely didn't have his best game yesterday. So much for doing what he does best, he had a very poor 4th quarter.

It obviously wasn't the most entertaining game but congratulations to Yale on winning the whole thing.

Yesterday? Look at his other provincial games? He is HORRIBLE. And I've seen Nikai play before which is why he comes as no surprise. Only thing he is good for is his athleticism. He can rebound, steal, and block. Offensive skill is horrible.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not on the Mara bandwagon, he shoots way too much, especially from distance, but I expected a bit better than a 12 point, 5 turnover performance from him. I would agree that Barker carried them throughout the tournament (vs. Argyle: 19 pts, 16 rebs, vs. VC: 15 pts, 16 rebs and vs. Yale: 11 pts, 17 rebs)
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TheReturnOfWhiteChocolate



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PostSubject: Re: Provincial Tittle   Sun Mar 21, 2010 4:48 pm

2/13 fg, 5/9 ft, 5 fouls, 5 turnovers in the final

1/13 fg, doesn't even get to the ft line, 6 turnovers in the semi's

6/18 fg, 10/16 ft, 4 fouls, 6 turnovers in the QF against a team they beat by 20...

I don't think I've seen a worse performance receive an all-star. Those numbers are so inefficient that it seems his team might have been better off without him...
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Burnaby-Hoops



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PostSubject: All-Stars   Mon Mar 22, 2010 6:09 pm

The All-Star teams looked fair this year. The Firsts weren't hard to pick, nor was picking Marek Klassen as your MVP. I sometimes wish there was a Fourth All-Star team so more kids could get recognition for their play. Realistically, handing out trophies to twenty players is a bit much; however, annoucing some sort of "Honourable Mentions" team during the awards ceremony could work. Here's what my fourth All-Star team would look like. I've adjusted all of the All-Star teams to how I see fit.

First All-Star Team
Mike Lewandowski (Pitt Meadows)
Philip Scrubb (Vancouver College)
Marek Klassen (Yale)
Matt Letkeman (Yale)
Riley Barker (White Rock Christian)

Second All-Star Team
James Lum (Sir Charles Tupper)
* James Lum's drive and dish game was spectacular in all of Tupper's games. Lead the tournament in assists and his team in points. His shooting percents were not where I would have expected them to be, considering all the hype I had been hearing about Lum. His two's and FT's were okay, but his three point percent was not what it should be at. Nonetheless, a fantastic player.
David Wagner (South Kamloops)
Mac Roth (Terry Fox)
Spencer Evans (Pitt Meadows)
Ater Degal (Burnaby South)
* Was the only consistent scorer for South; pushed 30 points in a couple of their games.

Third Team All-Stars
Warren Liang (Sir Charles Tupper)
* Tupper's grade eleven big man completely dominated South, inside and outside. Was good for 10 rebounds a game. I was not too impressed with him in his previous games though, especially against Argyle. His shot selection was very poor and he seemed to be taking teammates like Cammeron Smythe and Michael Braam out of the game. I would have liked to see him try to use his size in the paint to his advantage more often; he seemed to settle for jump shots too often.
Jesse Jeffers (Argyle)
* Many were arguing that Jesse should have grabbed a Second. I went and looked at the boxscores for his games. He shot the ball well from three but his two point field goal percent was horrible, considering how many of his shots were layups. It took him 43 field goal attempts and 14 free throw attempts to score 50 points against Tupper. Did display great athletism and as mentioned a nice touch from beyond the arc.
Daniel Edwards (Burnaby South)
* Was the second leading scorer and leading rebounder for South. Very good leaper - was on the offensive boards all tournament. Averaged about 13 points, 13 rebounds.
Reese Pribilsky (Oak Bay)
* Reese was fighting a lone battle at this tournament with his Oak Bay Squad. Noakes had one nice game, but the Bays recieved little from any other players, especially Post. Completely lead his team, scoring about 25 against both Pitt and Terry Fox.
Eli Mara (White Rock Christian)
* To be honest, I wasn't overly impressed with Mara in this tournament. Physically, he is a man playing with boys (we musn't forget that he is 19). His shooting percents both from outside and around the hoop were dismal. To his credit, Mara did lead his team defensively, doing an especially nice job on Phil in the fourth quarter of the VC game. Did a great job at calming down the troops whenever things got rough; definetly showing his veteran-leadership.

Fourth Team All-Stars
Reiner Theil (Vancouver College)
* I understand that the 3rd place team at Provincials is going to receive two All-Stars. Unfortunately, VC did not have any player besides Phil who was truly deserving of one. The tournament committee handed Jackson Forsythe a third (Averaged under 10 points a game with only a few rebounds or assists, and a low shooting percent). I couldn't bare to give a starting SG who scored over 10 points in only one his teams games an All-Star. I considered Sam Williams, as he averaged about 13 boards and generally played his role for the Irish. However, his scoring was too quite awful as he failed to score a point in two of their games. Finally, I resided on Reiner Theil. His scoring was better than Sam's and about the same as Jackson's, but Reiner was also good for rebounds, assists, and steals in every game. Still not fully deserving of an All-Star, but because I understand the politics of handing out said All-Stars, he'll receive one on my list.
Michael Braam (Sir Charles Tupper)
* Leading scorer for the Tupper in two of their games. Averaged about 20 points per contest, shooting 45-50% from beyond the arc. A good scorer who hit big shots for his team.
Christian Weisbrod (White Rock Christian)
* Third leading scorer for WRCA. Opened up the floor for Eli and Riley with his deadly three point shooting. Gave a low scoring team the points they needed to advance to the finals of the BC's. His two shots in the last minute against VC were huge.
Nakai Luyken (Yale)
* I definetly expected more out of the grade eleven stand out. Yale wouldn't have been able to win the title without him, but still he did not have a good tournament. As someone alluded to in an earlier post, his offensive deficencies really showed at these provincials. Though his scoring was not up to par, he still managed to fill the stat sheet in other categories. Used his superb athletism to his advantage.
Bret Macdonald (Terry Fox)
* Fox needs another All-Star and I thought Macdonald was their second best player. Was good for 10 points, 5 assists, and 5 rebounds a game. Ran his teams offense flawlessly. Played his role within Chamber's system. I was also impressed with Scott Hind (especially his three point shooting), but he did not play as consistently as Macdonald did.
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