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 REB 2009 Sr Boys

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Rebel Hoops



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Join date : 2009-12-07

PostSubject: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Mon Dec 07, 2009 10:12 pm

First day matchups at REB this Thursday

Clarence Fulton (B.C.) vs St. Joseph's (Sask)
Winner plays Palmdale, California

Jasper Place vs Foothills
Winner plays Holy Trinity (Ont)

St. Francis Xavier vs Grant Park (Man)
Winner plays South Kamloops (B.C.)

Strathcona vs Bev Facey
Winner plays Galveston, Texas

See the website for updates.
REB 2009
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canuck



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Location : Alberta

PostSubject: looks like a good one   Tue Dec 08, 2009 11:06 am

Tough to predict with several US teams. I hope Alberta can put in a good showing, I've bolded my picks:

Round 1
Clarence Fulton (B.C.) vs St. Joseph's (Sask)
Jasper Place vs Foothills
St. Francis Xavier vs Grant Park (Man)
Strathcona vs Bev Facey

Round 2
Clarence Fulton vs Palmdale, CA
JP vs Holy Trinity
St FX vs South Kamloops
Strathcona vs Galveston, TX

Round 3
JP vs Palmdale
South Kamloops vs Galveston

Final
Palmdale vs Galveston
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:13 pm

Texas in a romp over a really bad Ontario team. The team from California was worse. I'm sure there are a lot fine Canadian teams to choose from than that team from Califonia! Watched the JP game against Ontario and FX and for a team that is being touted as number 1 in Alberta Stanley better teach them how to play "D" soon or there not leaving the city of Edmonton in March! In the FX rematch the lack of effort and knowledge on "D" was quite evident as FX kept playing smart and almost won the game.

The James kid needs to play a lot more and Stanley needs to find someone to get his post players the ball as watching number 15 play 40 minutes and consistently go 1 on 4 is pretty painful to watch!! He has some nice post players inclduing a new kid I've never seen before, who is this guy anyway? and they never see the ball as the guards go 1 on everybody! This team is not beating Shep or Ainly anytime soon.
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runninred



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PostSubject: Rebels Follower   Thu Dec 17, 2009 5:22 pm

Ok D PARK Rebels heard you loud and clear. Let me declare that I am not a player but affiliated with the team in a supportive role. I am going to take heat on this one because if Stanley finds out that I am responding to this last post my hand will get slapped.
Yes, you are correct that defence needs to be worked on but lets keep in mind that as an internal observer they have put in some offences patterns that are sophisticated and takes time to understand. That being said and without excuses the time spent on defence needs to lengthen. Rebels did lose at FX then went 3-1 in Reb and beat FX by 7. There is no question that the coaches have been frustrated by the defensive effort and Stanley was the first to say that we the Rebels read their press clippings and need to focus on little things. At this stage the Rebels are undefeated in league play at 2-0 and undefeated currently at the North Shore Invitational where they beat Belmont 95-83 and defence was not good but after a day of early travel and fying out to Vancouver then rushing to game time not so bad. Rebels went on to beat the home team (Carson Graham)105 - 67 and they played outstanding defence. Prob the best effort thus far. Bufffie has had back to back 30 point games and Brin Taylor #15 (your 1 on 4 player) played the best team games of the year. There is no question that #15 can go one on one but Stanley has him in check and there is great growth on the floor. Sebastian is in peru visiting family and the Rebels are still playing well. Yes D Park, we know you like James and he has played well as a grade 10 but there have been lots of learning going on and he is prone to rookie errors like anyone else. He played outstanding in Vancouver as he went 9/10 from the line and had 14 points overall in quarters. He played great defence and logged 27 minutes. He is stepping up and will be a great player soon to be. The Rebels agree with you Mr. Park but give credit where credit is due and dont sell the Rebs too short as they have showed flashes of good defence and know that is where they need to start spending more time. Early in the year for March predictions my friend and a tad bold to say that the Rebels wont qualify for Provincials. That is a bet I would like to take especially when all coaches have submitted them as ranked number 1 or 2 out of Edmonton. Could be a Western (#1 province) and JP final in BC if they both win their respective semi finals in Vancouver.
Thanks for the perspective.[code]
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Fri Dec 18, 2009 12:41 am

Wow! what a whole bunch of nothing. There is nothing wrong with the effort of this team but effort is wasted if you don't what your doing! Part of good defence is being taught good defence and Youngs and Hoyt do a better job of teaching there athletes how to defend and that is why they stand a better chance of wining a provincial title. As for 15 I hope Stanley has him in check mainly becuase he is not that good! and shouldn't be going one on one with anybody. One on One basketball is only good in the NBA and he is not going there! he is not even a average ACAC player yet! sorry he i sno Marcus Shafer now or ever!!

As for James I saw a line up against FX that had James, the red head post player and two other guys don't know who they are (10 & 11) and 15 and other than 15 the other 4 guys were defending then he put Buffie, Cava and Swamp? back in and FX started to come back into the game! when defending well and scoring welll why go away from it! This is where bad coaching comes in. As for the future no team has won a provincial title relying on a core of players who played junior in grade 10. Sorry that is just the facts!!
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Smitty



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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Fri Dec 18, 2009 1:46 am

Oak Bay 93 Western Canada 75
Charles Tupper 84 Jasper Place 80
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runninred



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PostSubject: Whole lot of nothin   Fri Dec 18, 2009 2:00 pm

Your observations are on one game! Yikes!!!! You must get killed on proline lol. Dont put the house up. Shep and Ainlay are better defensively and more prepared for provincials? That is why JP has gone the last four years to provincials and knocked out shep with stellar defensive play and Ainlay year before. You talked about facts are facts. How bout you recognize that JP continues to get fed by lower tiered junior high teams but they are always in the hunt (fact). Southside junior shchools have dominated the junior high scene for 20 years. All three programs (jp, shep, ainlay) are consistently in top 7 or 8 for province each year. Rotations of players come through and the Baker, Suderman and company era is over so Ainlay looks to retool with the likes of Peterson and company. It is also the Haakand company era at shep who look good. So instead of talking abpout coaches and their poor strategies recognize the rotation of talent that comes around. Enough said there Shafer is from JP FACT and he is one of the best defensive players in the province coming out of high school as well as Dallas Wright who plays for Concordia. Year before, Rebs win bronze in province and 5 players go to college and play in ACAC. You need more than one game to make a review I guess and your downer on taylor is offside as he has done some great things to date and how do you rate him as a non potential acac player when the kid is just 16 years old and still growing and also dominatees many games. Dont be a downer on players. You seem to be anti rebels. Rebels have only lost twice in 14 games so facts are facts.
Rebels play Western for bronze in the 16 team north shore invitational today. Guard play could pinch the Rebels as Crowfoot, Prochnau and company are quick and shoot well. Coleman (JP) has been a beast and if you check out the stats on north shore invitational he is averaging around 28 points, 15 rebs. With Western rated as prob #1 they should win but if the Rebels steal a game from them then that would mean that D Park would be out to lunch cuz that would mean that the Rebels would have had to play D. Fun - Yes Park you were right a "whole lot of nothing". Facts are facts. check out the scores tonight to see who wins. Talk in March when the chips are on table instead of a 5 month early prediction based on one half of play that you winessed.
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canuck



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PostSubject: if you'd like to follow along...   Fri Dec 18, 2009 2:01 pm

here is the website (although the updates are a little slow):

http://www.sportvictoria.com/basketball/2009-10/2009-10%20NSIT.htm
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Sat Dec 19, 2009 1:29 am

Marcus Shafer hmm 6 points a game 7 assists in 12 games total and 14 turnovers some great player! Typical Rebel player unwilling and unable to share the basketball and make teammates better. Lets see provincial championship won by Shep in the last 12 years I believe its 5 or 6 and JP "zero" I believe!! JP players making an impact in the NCAA's Shep 1 (Bucknor) JP Amar Harknell please give me a flipping break. JP plyers on the CIS level none I believe! Dallas Wright please! sure he can defend a little but after 3 years at JP he still doesn't know how to dribble or shoot and does not need to be guarded on offence.

I believe only Cornish of the 5 are still playing if they haven't flunked out! and Cornish himself has stated that JP had nothing to do with his develpment and that he has learned more in a season at Concordia than he learend in 3 at JP! Which isn't saying much since they really don't get much coaching at Concordia either. He would be an All Canadian if he had gone to Mount Royal and worked under Dobell!! As for Taylor with proper coaching he could be so much better. So far he is average!! Manny was better when he was 12 correctio 10 years old and this kid thinks he headed to the States! Please!!! Keep it coming I have lots more!!

JP basketball overblown and overated!
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runninred



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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Sat Dec 19, 2009 2:31 am

dpark what's your coaching record?
alex butts, a star for augustana is still playing ACAC guess you don't pay much attention to that
please when you go to quote some one use a link for proof, no reason to believe some one that's all talk otherwise
funny how you mentioned marcus' offensive stats as a rookie but not his defensive stats
who have you sent to the NCAA?
since i'm guessing zero and your all talk i'm just gonna ignore you
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Sat Dec 19, 2009 11:13 am

mmm Augustana 3-9 and have won less than 6 games in 3 years. Butts a star! please he developed his game at Romero not JP and his game is not that much really. Marcus Shafer stats http://www.dakstats.com/WebSync/Pages/Team/IndividualStats.aspx?association=22&sg=MBB&sea=ACAMBB_2009&conference=ACAMBB1_ACACN&team=4917 they are still not good. As for NCAA, CIS & CCAA to many my friend!!

Giving up I guess!
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Sat Dec 19, 2009 11:17 am

Blown out by Western Canada in the bronze. There goes that number 1 ranking!! Hey its ok to admit you just don't have the horses and that the focus should be on development for the future.
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runninred



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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Sat Dec 19, 2009 1:45 pm

dpark wrote:
mmm Augustana 3-9 and have won less than 6 games in 3 years. Butts a star! please he developed his game at Romero not JP and his game is not that much really. Marcus Shafer stats http://www.dakstats.com/WebSync/Pages/Team/IndividualStats.aspx?association=22&sg=MBB&sea=ACAMBB_2009&conference=ACAMBB1_ACACN&team=4917 they are still not good. As for NCAA, CIS & CCAA to many my friend!!

Giving up I guess!
to many is a number or a name, didn't give your record so your probably just a a cocky kid who thinks he can talk
if you think alex developed his game at romero than you are an even bigger fool than originally thought, if it wasn't for rick stanley alex butts would have only gotten to red shirt at augustana if he was lucky, no other coachs wouldn't have gone to him in the summer and said that it was a big mistake not taking him, obviously you have never watched an augustana game this year or last year if you think Alex isn't a star that team has no bench, guys like alex, joe, shane and david ness have to compensate for everyone else's lack of defense so they take fouls that they wouldn't have to on other team's
marcus's number's are numbers of a rookie

any ways i doubt too many people would agree with your dumb comments. you only have made one correct comment we haven't played good this year. but here's something even you can agree with better to play bad d at the start of the year than provincials
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Sat Dec 19, 2009 3:20 pm

The only stars on that team are David Ness (excellent coaching from his brothers) and Shayn (excellent coaching from the Edmonton Grads club team he played on for two seasons). Your Alex works hard and is a good kid but his skills are limited and he certainly had atteniton at Romero. Rest of that bunch at AUC is sorry!!. As for playing better late that is totally right but that will only happen "IF" you make provincials and you need to play well early to get a shot.
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CalBall



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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Mon Dec 28, 2009 12:51 am

Wow someone really hates Jasper Place, But i believe your right Dpark in that they lack defense! The most important factor in ALL SPORTS, on the other hand, i think JP has one of the most skilled starting line ups ive seen this year and may be a contender in the provincials.
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runninred



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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Mon Dec 28, 2009 6:15 pm

dpark wrote:
The only stars on that team are David Ness (excellent coaching from his brothers) and Shayn (excellent coaching from the Edmonton Grads club team he played on for two seasons). Your Alex works hard and is a good kid but his skills are limited and he certainly had atteniton at Romero. Rest of that bunch at AUC is sorry!!. As for playing better late that is totally right but that will only happen "IF" you make provincials and you need to play well early to get a shot.
BTW who is your source on Alex Butts? i know him personally and honestly you have been bery very very misinformed if you think had interest while at romero

yes our defense is lasking but we have sepent the last week working on that, that's what you do over christmas and exam breaks work on the weak spots in your game if you don't think that than you don't know that much
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Tue Dec 29, 2009 2:21 pm

mmm While at Romero Alex Butts send out DVD's to a fair amount of coaches and I can get my hands on one of the DVD's and send to you. Based on the DVD there was some interest. This is the whole thinking in Edmonton high school that unless you’re going to Shep, JP or Ainly your never going to be noticed when in fact there are more athletes from perceived less important Edmonton schools producing players just as good and in a lot of ways more team players and more dedicated to the class room. Maybe if those 3 schools built there program with local kids like everyone else does in the country we would see other athletes getting a shot. Why some kids would transfer schools to sit on the bench just to win is beyond me. It’s more important to play than win in some aspects. High School players develop playing not sitting on a bench. The truth is high school is not about develop anymore its about winning!! My college coaching friends tell me that there biggest problem is kids who believe they play above veterans because they are from Shep, JP or Ainly! I guess this why the NAIT coach went out and got Toronto athletes to show Edmonton high school coaches how really poor a job they are actually doing! BTW not the JP hater just an honest observer. Watched the games in Sugar Bowl and the JP team that beat Myers is a better team than the one that lost to Cardiston. More of a team.
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runninred



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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:27 pm

dpark wrote:
mmm While at Romero Alex Butts send out DVD's to a fair amount of coaches and I can get my hands on one of the DVD's and send to you. Based on the DVD there was some interest. This is the whole thinking in Edmonton high school that unless you’re going to Shep, JP or Ainly your never going to be noticed when in fact there are more athletes from perceived less important Edmonton schools producing players just as good and in a lot of ways more team players and more dedicated to the class room. Maybe if those 3 schools built there program with local kids like everyone else does in the country we would see other athletes getting a shot. Why some kids would transfer schools to sit on the bench just to win is beyond me. It’s more important to play than win in some aspects. High School players develop playing not sitting on a bench. The truth is high school is not about develop anymore its about winning!! My college coaching friends tell me that there biggest problem is kids who believe they play above veterans because they are from Shep, JP or Ainly! I guess this why the NAIT coach went out and got Toronto athletes to show Edmonton high school coaches how really poor a job they are actually doing! BTW not the JP hater just an honest observer. Watched the games in Sugar Bowl and the JP team that beat Myers is a better team than the one that lost to Cardiston. More of a team.
dpark the reason alex sent those dvd's out is because he has a friend at carleton that told him he wouldn't get any attention any other way, he also had been helping him out with his game every summer before going to jp now he has started helping again because to no offense to augustana's coach but that's a huge step down from jp in the coaching and depth department
hmm... if shep, jp and ainlay have are overated and players aren't that could than how come all three have had people go onto ACAC/CIS over the last couple of years,how come in alex's rookie year it was put in to augustana's newspaper that he and grady were the players in best shape of any body on that team?
in regards to the cardston game, we were playing without one of our top players in seb, had south refs in the south while playing against the a south team, if you don't understand what kind of effect that would have on the game than obviously you weren't there so don't make stupid comments
if you were an honest observer than you wouldn't be attacking past players, coach sir, and be ignoring the good parts in our game so honest observer you are not.
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Tue Dec 29, 2009 9:59 pm

Coach Sir! who the hell is that because its certainly not me!! As for Alex Butts like most players he was mislead. If you’re a good player a good coach and recruiter will find you even if you’re playing at Archbishop Romero. As for Shep, Ainly and JP. Lets count the players. In ACAC Concordia has 2 JP players and one Shep I believe, The Danish kid does not count! Same amount of players as Eastglen (powerhouse) and Concordia MacEwan has 2, Augustana 1, Lakeland 0, GPRC 0, NAIT 0, Kings 0 so there is a grand total of 5 JP guys and I believe a couple of Shep guys, no Ainly guys in the ACAC and maybe 1 CIS. In fact off of Ainly's last provincial gold medal not one player played at the next level. In fact for a couple of years in this past decade there more player from schools like Eastglen, St. Joe's, Wagner, Paul Kane, St. Albert, O'Leary and currently ABJ playing next level basketball than players from the big three! Why because the coaches (all linked to Don Horwood) do not prepare there athletes for the next level where coaches will not "kiss there asses" and give them there way, where they have to produce in the team concept or sit down! They learn how to win high schools games and that's it! The truth of the matter is the team doing the best job of preparing athletes (boys and girls) for the next level is the Edmonton Grads Basketball club whose numbers dwarf the high schools. Golly gee!! I wonder why that is!! One of my coaching friends told me that over the past few years ago more than 50% of the Edmonton Journal All Stars were members of the Grads. A quick count of the ACAC shows 19 former Grads playing in the ACAC North alone. Now that is development!! No one is attacking players here there are some really nice players on JP, they are mainly sitting on the bench while some who can't defend or guard a lamp post are playing. Most the real players were playing against Myer from what I can see.
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Sun Jan 03, 2010 11:44 pm

Sleep


Last edited by CalBall on Sun Mar 21, 2010 3:39 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:54 pm

You make some good points but one of the points is flawed. As a former college coach I would never look at what a player scored in a game. In fact the scoring average is not in the least bit important why? because at the next level they are not going to score like that and if they did the would not be playing CIS or CCAA. Recruiters and coaches focus on little things like how are their fundamentals, are they willing to rebound, dive on the floor for loose balls, and most importantly how do they defend. Do they take it personally when their man scores on them and really really important how do they play up or down 20 points! is there a difference in there attitude down 20. Give me the kid that is getting on his teammates down 20 and pushing them to work harder, going after loose balls and go all out to get back in the game never giving up until the final whistle. The player is called a winner!! That is a player I want on my team the rest I can fix.

Scoring 36 points in a game I don't know, did they share the ball? Were they looking for the good shot or the great shot? These are character things and I can tell you that on the JP team when things get tough the stars (15 in particular) start whining and bitching at there teammates and putting them down not inspiring them like true leaders!! As for small schools well the current CIS player of the year (female) played at 2A high school in Calgary and she was discovered. The Golden Bear number 1 female recruit is from a 2A school in Edmonton.

Coaches and recruiters watch blow outs to see who is competing because if you can't compete you will never play at the next level because you can't teach compete!! There is no levels when it comes to competing either you can or you can’t. Anyone can compete when there up 20, competing when your down 20 now that’s special!
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Mon Jan 04, 2010 5:14 pm

Valid points dpark but I disagree that coaches are looking for strong defenders. They may say they are but when it comes down to it they want players who can score. If a player is a weaker defender than he better score more points to compensate for it. There are very few players chosen for post sec or provincial teams based on their defensive prowess. I beleive that players want to play for the high profile programs to get exposure, better competition, access to the more exciting tournaments( Sugarbowl REB etc..) and perceived better coaching. This mirrors what happens in the US at DIV 1 schools all the time.
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Mon Jan 04, 2010 6:46 pm

Sorry but your wrong. As I coach who has coached in Canada and the US coaches are looking for good defenders first because when it comes to winning championship it starts and ends with defence. Coaches don't trust players on the floor who can score only they need to defend and here is why. When it down to the last possession and its under 10 seconds and your leading the players who can defend will be out there not the players who can score. Its a combination of those who can score and defend. Picking a provincial team and a college team are two different things. High school athletes are so poorly coached that your looking for the best athlete for provincial teams. At the post secondary level your looking for the athlete who can score and defend and your more willing to settle for the a player who can score a little and defend a lot as opposed to someone who can score a lot and defend a little.

As for the intentions for high school athletes in Edmonton they have a better chance of betting noticed if they don't go to those schools just by virtue of the fact that some of the lesser schools as they are called send more kids to the next level every year than the big 3. Throughout the 20's more players from Eastglen have placed at the next level than JP!! Also shooting for the DIV 1 schools is a foolish dream that is reversed for the truly elite. Its not for the average high school player in Canada and any player thinking or wishing for it is not dealing with a full deck. Since Bucknor at Shep there has been one yes one! Edmonton high school player make a Div 1 program and that is Manny and he is never going to start there and be over recruited every year (see Denham Brown). The odds are slim to none.

As for perceived better coaching that is all it is perceived. Anyone can coach when you have all the best athletes (see: Shep!!) but the true mark of a great coach is competing and beating those teams with lesser talent. Using this method the best coaching in Edmonton in the 2000's was George Hoyt when he was at Eastglen and my personal choice Darrel Cleave at Louis St. Laurent.
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Sun Jan 10, 2010 11:19 pm

Seems that all is well at the top of the standings in Edmonton. Will it remain so is the question particular in the future. Same top 3 years after year! I guess that is how we develop the game. Let's kids go anywhere and pretend that the top 3 don't recruit players. Maybe things will change in the future probably not! He who has the best talent wins and damm the coaching. Why coach when I can recruit the best from across the area and seduce them to come to my program.
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PostSubject: Re: REB 2009 Sr Boys   Tue Jan 12, 2010 6:23 am

My my, someone sure likes the "sound of the their own voice".

I'm curious, have you registered how hard you're working to pick a fight with basically no one...which in of itself should tell you what people think about your musings. Or, have you looked back through your diatribes to see how often you've contradicted yourself thus making many of your points....pointless.

But you go ahead and name drop some more, names of people in which I doubt you've ever actually had a real conversation. Or, by all means, continue to demonstrate for us your incredibly poor understanding of just basic facts about this basketball community. (Oops, that was pointed out already) Just continue to pretend you have any true understanding about the "next level" that you didn't read out of a book, what kids need for it and what coaches are looking for in them. Or you can continue to read your fictitious resume to us in an attempt to convince everyone that you MUST know what you're talking about.

And finally, as you denigrate kids and their schools about their academics please continue demonstrating your own wondrous grasp of the English language and the grammar required to convey it to others.

So, you were busy explaining basketball in Edmonton to those of us involved in it for 20, 25, 30+ years, carry on....
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