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 new tiering proposal

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thegediknight



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PostSubject: new tiering proposal   Fri Mar 11, 2011 4:09 pm

This is for coaches throughout the province of BC.

You may or may not be aware that there are some motions being voted on at the BCHSBBA AGM meeting next Saturday. The motions bring forth some significant changes to the way that Boys basketball would be structured in the province.

It is crucial that all coaches are aware of these motions so that they might be able to make an informed decision and place their vote as they see fit.

If you would like a copy of the proposal please reply to this message with your email and I will send you the file.

or email me at mathew.geddes@smus.ca
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bball guy



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sat Mar 12, 2011 11:24 am

I've read the proposal. It is very scary, and will have a long term impact on the quality of high school basketball in B.C.. It will result in less kids wanting to play basketball as the best teams will not be allowed to compete against the best. It will impact not only private schools, but also public schools (traditional basketball schools - Pitt, Kitsilano, Tamanawis.........just to name a few).

If it is not broke, do not fix it.

This is reverse discrimination in effect. A kid who just happens to go to an A level school and is gifted in basketball, will no longer be given the choice to go to any other school and play the game he or she loves. This is illegal. BC High School Basketball does not have authority or power over this. This will become a political issue (big picture politics).

Sponsors will not want to associate themselves with a watered down version of high school basketball championships. Good-bye Telus.

And it will open the system to a lot of lawsuits.........and given the degree of interest on this forum, that is indeed a given. We live in a free world of choice, and taking that choice out of the system and suggesting that a certain school "owns" a player is RIDICULOUS. Sounds like left wing B.C. NDP philosophy and we are turning schools into unions. If a kid is interested in moving to a school that has a specialty in a certain area, he should be allowed to. Regulating the system does not work. The issue is Recruiting, and in my opinion, rules are in place and we just need to adhere to them. Look at this year's high school tourney, it is not tainted by recruiting.

I would suggest if this is passed, a movement will be brought forward to dismantle BC High School Basketball Association, bring the issue to the Minister of Education, and make this even bigger by including ALL kids who transfer schools in BC (Arts, theatre, French immersion, trades, etc....). New representation will be required. This is about the kids (not just the ones who are in large, public schools).

I hope that this vote fails. Man, do we need some leadership now more than ever.
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Mark Scott



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sat Mar 12, 2011 11:36 am

bball guy wrote:
I've read the proposal. It is very scary, and will have a long term impact on the quality of high school basketball in B.C.. It will result in less kids wanting to play basketball as the best teams will not be allowed to compete against the best. It will impact not only private schools, but also public schools (traditional basketball schools - Pitt, Kitsilano, Tamanawis.........just to name a few).

If it is not broke, do not fix it.

This is reverse discrimination in effect. A kid who just happens to go to an A level school and is gifted in basketball, will no longer be given the choice to go to any other school and play the game he or she loves. This is illegal. BC High School Basketball does not have authority or power over this. This will become a political issue (big picture politics).

Sponsors will not want to associate themselves with a watered down version of high school basketball championships. Good-bye Telus.

And it will open the system to a lot of lawsuits.........and given the degree of interest on this forum, that is indeed a given. We live in a free world of choice, and taking that choice out of the system and suggesting that a certain school "owns" a player is RIDICULOUS. Sounds like left wing B.C. NDP philosophy and we are turning schools into unions. If a kid is interested in moving to a school that has a specialty in a certain area, he should be allowed to. Regulating the system does not work. The issue is Recruiting, and in my opinion, rules are in place and we just need to adhere to them. Look at this year's high school tourney, it is not tainted by recruiting.

I would suggest if this is passed, a movement will be brought forward to dismantle BC High School Basketball Association, bring the issue to the Minister of Education, and make this even bigger by including ALL kids who transfer schools in BC (Arts, theatre, French immersion, trades, etc....). New representation will be required. This is about the kids (not just the ones who are in large, public schools).

I hope that this vote fails. Man, do we need some leadership now more than ever.


Thanks for giving your thoughtful insight. I look forward to seeing the proposal whenever it becomes public. It should be made available to all before the vote, since it affects so many kids.
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bball guy



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sat Mar 12, 2011 1:15 pm

The proposal only went to coaches.

There is an email strategy going on right now to reach as many coaches as possible before the middle of this week (as per the topic of this topic stream). If they do get the email and read the proposal (big assumption as it is long), they would not even have time to discuss this issue with their schools, parents and players to come to an informed, consensus driven decicision on what their school should do.
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ebe



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sat Mar 12, 2011 5:29 pm

The proposals that are going to the AGM come from the President's committee which is comprised of BCHSBBA executive & Governors. This committee has met dozens of times and have sub-committee meetings with over 30 coaches from all levels as well as parents and community members. They also put out an online survey to all members which received over 100 responses and they had an open forum at the BBC coaching clinic. The proposals have been sent out to all schools through the BCHSBBA website so I believe the committee has tried very hard to include all schools. Unfortunately it still seems to be a bit of a struggle to get the information out to everyone as there always seems to be some some gaps in communication. I think many of these motions are excellent and I think there are some that are not so good but hopefully we can get a big turnout of coaches to discuss them at our AGM. Bball guy I think perhaps that you may be a little alarmist about these proposals to say that they are scary might be a bit over the top. These proposals are centered around two main topics: tiering and transfers. the last time tiering was changed was over 25 years ago and the truth is we have way more schools playing than we did at that time. I remember when we went to three tiers and some people were talking about all the doom and gloom that it would bring but it has turned out to be very good for high school basketball. Adding a fourth tier with 4 tiers having around the same number of teams in it is potentially very exciting as it will give more kids the opportunity to make a provincial championship. It also could open up the possibility of running championships at the same venue which could be very exciting. Also bball guy there is not a single proposal that stops a kid from transfering there is some proposed new language around when transfer rules kick in but all of the fear mongering in your post about this issue is really not accurate. There are also proposals with regard to making eligibility decisions more transparent and including alumni and boosters in the recruting language. A huge amount of work has gone in to this report and now it will be in the hands of the membership to decide which proposals they want to move forward with.
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thegediknight



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PostSubject: new tiering proposal   Sat Mar 12, 2011 6:33 pm

For the record, there was unanimous opposition to these motions at the AA coaches meeting here in Kamloops at the provincial tournament. There are a number of reasons why these proposals are not in the best interests of basketball in BC.

But opinions aside, due process was not followed with these motions. Contrary to what ebe says they were not sent out to coaches or Athletic Directors at schools. Perhaps some, but none that I know of. There were only two coaches at the AA meeting that were even aware that these proposals were in the works. Both of these coaches were from the Fraser Valley and both attended some sub-committee meetings.

Given the number of responses from coaches wanting to read the proposal for the first time, I would say that someone dropped the ball in terms of communication.

There really should be no way that these proposals should be voted on in a week considering how few schools are aware
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Sportvictoria



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sat Mar 12, 2011 7:35 pm

ebe wrote:
The proposals that are going to the AGM come from the President's committee which is comprised of BCHSBBA executive & Governors. This committee has met dozens of times and have sub-committee meetings with over 30 coaches from all levels as well as parents and community members. They also put out an online survey to all members which received over 100 responses and they had an open forum at the BBC coaching clinic. The proposals have been sent out to all schools through the BCHSBBA website so I believe the committee has tried very hard to include all schools. Unfortunately it still seems to be a bit of a struggle to get the information out to everyone as there always seems to be some some gaps in communication. I think many of these motions are excellent and I think there are some that are not so good but hopefully we can get a big turnout of coaches to discuss them at our AGM. Bball guy I think perhaps that you may be a little alarmist about these proposals to say that they are scary might be a bit over the top. These proposals are centered around two main topics: tiering and transfers. the last time tiering was changed was over 25 years ago and the truth is we have way more schools playing than we did at that time. I remember when we went to three tiers and some people were talking about all the doom and gloom that it would bring but it has turned out to be very good for high school basketball. Adding a fourth tier with 4 tiers having around the same number of teams in it is potentially very exciting as it will give more kids the opportunity to make a provincial championship. It also could open up the possibility of running championships at the same venue which could be very exciting. Also bball guy there is not a single proposal that stops a kid from transfering there is some proposed new language around when transfer rules kick in but all of the fear mongering in your post about this issue is really not accurate. There are also proposals with regard to making eligibility decisions more transparent and including alumni and boosters in the recruting language. A huge amount of work has gone in to this report and now it will be in the hands of the membership to decide which proposals they want to move forward with.


I like most of what I have read. There is definitely one proposal I would not be in favour of. But the rest I like. Since it is not a package deal, that could work out well. Going to have a spend a chunk of time this weekend reading the package - all 23 pages of it.

The 4-tier system I like... that many more teams get to play for a BC title - I think that is a good thing.

I would just like to see no restrictions if a team wishes to move up, which as been the norm. Only that they would have to stay up for 2 years so they can't opt to move up... then back the next year. I believe that used to be a rule in BCHSBBA years back.

Tightening up recruiting rules I think is also a good thing - really, it's just closing loop-holes.


Lyle Dhur
Sportvictoria
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zoons



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sat Mar 12, 2011 7:49 pm

I love these new proposals. The tiering issue is loooooong overdue. Just at the AA level the difference between school size is ridiculous. The AA number of boys in gr.11 and 12 goes from 81-225. That is a huge difference. A school with 81 boys competing every year with one that can choose a team with over 200 hundred is not a level playing field. I truly hope that the tiering proposal goes through. Ebe makes a great point about unifying all the prov. championships. That would be awesome. Our own BC March Madness. A one week, AA the next, AAA after and then AAAA. How exciting would that be. That would also help curb transfers and recruiting as players at the A or AA level wouldn't feel a need to be noticed at only one championship, they would all be going to the same venue and hopefully with similiar (inclusive) press and notoriety. Why not play at your school level and size? They do it in the best basketball nation in the world...the u.s. It doesn't matter what school you go to there...they all go to the state championships at the same venue. We seem to think that the US basketball isn't doing it properly? Let's follow their lead and learn from the best high school basketball system.

As for the transfer proposals. As it stands right now any student can go wherever they want. No one stands in anyones way of transfering. That is not going to change with the new proposal. Right now if you transfer after gr. 10 you have to sit out of league and playoff games for 1 season. Most programs have lots of exhibtion games and practices for transfers to join in on. It isn't working. Kids are just transfering before gr. 10 or simply transfering and playing a whole season minus a few lg. games and the playoffs. The goal is to strengthen high school basketball overall. More competitive schools, more opportunities for playoff success, more boys wanting to play in their region. The proposal moves the transfer cutoff from gr.10 to the first year in high school (gr.8or9) and makes it a real year to sit out. No exhibtion gms, no practice. That could really make transfers think twice. Anyway, everyone is entitled to their opinions. I look forward to the voting process next Sat.

Ebe....what is the voting process gonna look like? Can there be proxy votes???
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Mark Scott



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PostSubject: What's good for the goose?   Sat Mar 12, 2011 8:31 pm


If coaches transfer schools are they prevented from coaching that year.......?
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thegediknight



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PostSubject: new tiering proposal   Sat Mar 12, 2011 9:16 pm

My intention of putting this topic on the forum was not for discussion as this is certainly not the most appropriate venue.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and that is why it is important for all schools to first have the opportunity to actually read the motions and to have the opportunity to digest the magnitude of the changes.

If you have read the motions and you are a coach, go to the meeting, discuss your view point and vote. If you have not read the motions, don't listen to those who would wish to sway you one way or the other. Make up your mind for your self and for your school.

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bball_6319



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sat Mar 12, 2011 9:44 pm

zoons wrote:
Right now if you transfer after gr. 10 you have to sit out of league and playoff games for 1 season.

Unless you go to WRCA you mean
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Lefon Jang



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PostSubject: AAAA   Sat Mar 12, 2011 9:55 pm

What is the criteria to be in AAAA, is it based on the number of transfers or the strength of a school’s basketball team?
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zoons



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sat Mar 12, 2011 11:16 pm

All tiers would be based only on the enrollment of the school. They would have an equal amount of schools in each tier. I can't remember the exact number......I think it was like 68 schools per tier.
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ceelow75



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sun Mar 13, 2011 3:01 am

im hoping if someone can answer this question.

If a player was playing at an independent school 1 year then decide to transfer to a public school, would the player have to sit out a year.

I've been hearing different things. I heard that if the player transfer to the school that is in his catchment area, he didnt have to sit out. But if he went to a school that isnt in his catchment area, he would have to sit out.

Anyone know if this is true or not?
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bball guy



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sun Mar 13, 2011 12:43 pm

This year in Junior ball, WRCA beat SMU to win the Provincial championship (all schools elibible). I know a lot can change in the next couple of years, but these new tiering systems automatically put WRCA into A level ball, and SMU into AAA. In theory then, these schools will be better than the AAAA schools. WRCA goes to A level and can't play up, SMU goes to AAA. Traditional power like PITT no longer will be at the AAAA tourney (we will miss Coach Goulet doing his thing).

Let's assume 3rd place finisher in Junior this year Mouat wins AAAA in 2 years, but never played WRCA , Pitt or SMU. What did they really win ?? I think kids will want to play against the best competition, and the best teams. We won't see Mouat vs wrca again in a meaningful game.

This proposed system is exactly the same as volleyball (except the transfer issue in basketball is even more stringent)..........a real yawner when it comes to the provincial championship tournaments. Nobody knows who was the best volleybal team last year? The best games are played in tournaments where the top teams compete.

We should just give everyone a ribbon for participation. This proposal is a huge setback for BC high school basketball.

If this system does get approved, they need to grandfather it in.........i.e.) make it the system beginning in 2014.

I wonder what Steve Nash would think? He transferred in Grade 11 (sat out 1 year), and played at SMU. Why did he move from Arbutus to SMU?
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bball guy



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sun Mar 13, 2011 1:23 pm

The big issue is not the tiering (I like it). It is the issue around transfers and not allowing schools to play up. With respect to transfers, the proposal reads that if a student transfers after grade 8, they must sit out 1 year and cannot practice or play in exhibition games with their new school. The second issue is that schools will no longer be allowed to play up, they must play in their respective tier. I'm not aware of specific situations at wrca, but I don't think they have transfer / recruting allegations against them. Given they just won a Junior title, this school is now being forced to play A level basketball. How do you tell that to the kids on the team and tell them this is a good situation for you? SMU and Pitt are in the same boat, they won't be allowed to compete for a real title.

If you allow schools the choice to play up, I would support these new tiers. I think the transfer issue needs a little work as Grade 8 is way too early for a student not to have the choice to transfer.

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Mark Scott



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:20 pm

bball guy wrote:
The big issue is not the tiering (I like it). It is the issue around transfers and not allowing schools to play up. With respect to transfers, the proposal reads that if a student transfers after grade 8, they must sit out 1 year and cannot practice or play in exhibition games with their new school. The second issue is that schools will no longer be allowed to play up, they must play in their respective tier. I'm not aware of specific situations at wrca, but I don't think they have transfer / recruting allegations against them. Given they just won a Junior title, this school is now being forced to play A level basketball. How do you tell that to the kids on the team and tell them this is a good situation for you? SMU and Pitt are in the same boat, they won't be allowed to compete for a real title.

If you allow schools the choice to play up, I would support these new tiers. I think the transfer issue needs a little work as Grade 8 is way too early for a student not to have the choice to transfer.


I have read the proposal as well and agree entirely with your comments bball guy. I did not realize that WRCA is such small school (only 60 boys in grade 11 and 12). Congratulations to them! That is the kind of excellence we should reward, not penalize.

I appreciate the hard work the President's Committee put in to the report.
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zoons



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sun Mar 13, 2011 3:20 pm

Why do a bunch of posts keep saying that competing and winning a AAA championship is the only reward. If boys basketball can improve with better teams playing at every level than a A and AA and AAA and AAAA championships have great meaning. I love how many of you simply disregard A and AA teams as low end competition. Last time I checked there are a ton of bad AAA teams too. Its not a penalty to play at a smaller school and compete for a provinical championship. All provincial championships are difficult to win and have many good teams there. We should be trying to improve the overall level of basketball at all levels instead of simply stating you have to play at the AAA provincials or your program, team, players aren't very good. It doesn't say much about those of you that think of only one level rather than the overall improvement of basketball in our province. We will need to go a step further in order to make this tiering system worth it. A tournament committee needs to organize all four tier provincial championships in order to make them all top notch with equal press and prestige.
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stocktonsshorts



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sun Mar 13, 2011 5:34 pm

Zoons I agree with you. We need to look at the big picture, not what is best for one or two schools. Adding a fourth tier allows more teams an opportunity to compete for a championship which means more kids playing sport and learning the valuable life lessons that come with it. I believe girls volleyball adopted this structure a while back and the top teams in each tier are very comparable. Imagine having the A + AA provincials one week at the LEC (they have the courts) followed by the AAA + AAAA provincials at the same location the following week. All teams, all players and all championships uner one roof being celebrated by the entire province. I'm sure people could get behind 2 weeks of competition with 64 teams big and small competing. I know I could.
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valleyball



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sun Mar 13, 2011 5:56 pm

Pardon my ignorance that as I as parent, I am quite disappointed the high school basketball community has become so polarized.

If Basketball BC and all other stakeholders are so inclined to change the rules for high school basketball, an open transparent process is required in which all members of the basketball community have a "right" (coaches, ad's, academies, former players, and parents) to provide their input.

i would strongly suggest an arms length task force be struck that provide a long term vision rather than just "band aid solutions" which lack clarity, penalize a few, and simply do not allow the game to further prosper.

There also has to be a process of licensing/accreditation of high school coaches, so that at the grade 12 level, only the best coaches are provided these positions, especially such that if you are closing loopholes to the transferring process.

In my personal view, alot of the transfering occurs, when certain schools in a student's catchment do not provide the development program to further a kids progress in his chosen sport. Either the gyms aren't open, the coaching is terrible, there is no basketball culture at the school or desire to build it, and the student body are not committed. So what does an aspiring student do as high school basketball is the main proponent for further your exposure in the sport. Unlike other sports, where the community sporting clubs or association are the "primary" development model for getting to the next level.
In basketball, irrespective of a player attending drive, 3 D, or any other academy, or even playing for the provincial team, the most publicized programming is via the school system. As such with this predicament, BC Basketball has to either raise the recognition and promotion of the Community Programming or ensure the high school development model continues to offer the best coaching and player development. Right now there is such a discrepancy in high school basketball, that you cannot blame a good player from wanting to transfer, otherwise their development is being negatively effected.

I watch the program at WRCA and commend them for the consistency in their basketball programming. Their kids understand what the tradition and commitment level offered by the school and also expected by them. At a nearby high school, you do not have the same passion, standards and commitment level. Other public schools have also developed consistent development of their teams at all grades and have developed an excellent basketball culture.

So unlike other sports, where a player at his prime development years, has a choice in the community to transfer to say another rep hockey program or select soccer team, we have a created a high school basketball system which indirectly can jeapordize a player's development.

I think the BC Basketball should have some more vision and leadership in ensuring there is a level playing for every student athlete,

-maybe creating a regional system, whereby in each district, only certain schools will be permitted to play at the highest level, not just based on numbers of students, but rather a recognition of their quality programming and development of athletes. If on one hand every school is not putting the resources and investment into the sport, then why should the student athletes have to make a decision at grade 8. Sometimes you are sold a bag of false promises and realizes later

Otherwise, if this does not occur, as a parent, I believe BC Basketball and all the stakeholders need to understand the current lure of high school basketball, and begin to create "other regional models" during the school year which have more credibility and importance to a players development.
This way a player at a non basketball school, would not be tempted to transfer as the most serious and productive basketball programming would be outside the educational system (just like junior hockey or select soccer). The high school system should then be regarded as the secondary level of programming and this regional/club system which allows players to play where ever should be the primary focus.

Right now the process is so dysfunctional and polarized without stakeholders taking a rational non emotional approach. If the regional/club system framework was set up it would take away all of the politics and stress on the education system and subsequent transferring as families would priortize their chilld's development in the sport to outside of the school system.

Wake up basketball bc, coaches and stakeholders. Either overhaul the entire system, or ensure each student athlete in each region of the province is provided a level playing field, or regional high school to attend, whereby their coaching, programming, player commitment, travel, scheduling are at the same standards as WRCA, Kits or other traditional schools.

Dont blame the kids, blame yourselves for not providing your athletes a system which offers consistency, high standards and qualtiy programming thru out the province from grade 8-12
Right now the entire system is dysfunctional, with a prospective player pulled in various directions as the high school system has been promoted as the historic route to long term development, exposure and recognition

I hope all stakeholders take the time and effort to read this comment as it speaks volumes to the actual problem rather than focusing on band aid solutions or blame games

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Pooch



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sun Mar 13, 2011 6:36 pm

Excellent post.
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valleyball



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sun Mar 13, 2011 6:37 pm

I would hope all stakeholders take a real look at all other youth sports for student athletes and recognize ONLY high school basketball is recognized as the primary development via the educational system. You never of rep hockey player or select soccer players transferring schools due to their school teams.

For a sport so popular at the grassroots level, I firmly believe the elite/select level of this sport has to channeled outside the present school system IF we are going to not permit student athletes in their prime years to make fundamental decisions to further their progess in their sport.

In rep hockey, a family can travel 30 miles to a program which entails 5 days a week of training. In basketball, you are essentially stuck after grade 8, as per the proposed rules, in a team sport whereby you are relying on coaching, and team development.

If we created metro club teams at various levels (metro, selet, development) with the best coaches, then a family has a development system/model recognized and supported by Basketball BC which is being monitored for quality programming and development and would probably be supported by the basketball community. Some will suggest well your basketball academies provide this, I would totally disagree, The academies presently are a "supplement" to your high school teams and sometimes have 40 players with 1-2 coaches.

If we had tryouts for these regional/club teams in August. (Van West/Van East/Burn/North Shore/Richmond/Surrey Newton/South Surrey/Surrey GuildFord/Langley/ ETC) and provide them 4-5 intense trainings a week, with games on weekends, then it would address alot of the issues facing high school basketball. Basketball BC would provide a curriculum or vision for each age and club, and it would be monitored for effectively ensuring development is occuring at each level or a club loses its placing

Only the best and committed coaches would be hired and it would create a level of professionalism and accountability. Players would have the opportunity to play where ever based on the quality presented. Each club would have an A and B team at each age, and players would be moved up/down during the season.

Student athletes, then like amateur hockey, soccer and other sports would then attend their local high school for their academics like it should be for academics.

This proposal is being suggested because Basketball BC and high school coaches cannot have it both ways. On one hand promote and recognize high school bball as the be all and end all and then NOT ensure that each and every student athlete has a quality program in their catchment with respected coaches.
However, if want to continue to historic model, then please realize how uneven it presently is, as some schools train all year, and some schools do not even have one passionate teacher or coach to oversee the program. Some schools focus on other sports, and if this is the case, there should be a second/third tier for those non competitive schools irrespective of student population.

For example in the West Side of vancouver, either every school have the same standards (coaching, programming or development model) or create/recognize a system that students can attend 2-3 basketball focused schools in your region (kits/churchill/van colleg/saints). This is an option if we want to continue the present system. Further a school's student population should NOT be the sole criteria for determining what tier of basketball they should play. Some large public schools have excellent programs while others would not even make the Single A provincials, because they lack a basketball culture

This way, like other sports, creating a functional system irrespective of what area a student lives is confident they have excellent resources. It would create better competition for players, and allow inspiring players to choose where they want to further their skill.

So my suggestion to Basketball BC, either overhaul the ENTIRE system and take it away the high school, or if you want to continue the status quo of high school basketball, then ensure all triple a or four a schools have the same standards.

And allow a student who attends a school where basketball is not a priority (then this school should not be automatically playing the highest level) to them transfer to the HIGHEST LEVEL or Tier. This would also challenge ad's and schools to improve their product/programs

Right now the only criteria for determining tiering is a school's population which is somewhat misleading as everyone agrees Triple A is the highest level for competiveness and exposure.

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Naismith



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sun Mar 13, 2011 6:40 pm

valleyball - I think you forget that in public schools (and I'm sure in most private schools) the coaches are unpaid volunteers.

There are some coaches who have built great programs in their schools. I imagine they have done this out of a love for the game or a desire to have an impact in a kid's life.

It is unreasonable to expect the level of dedication you write about in every school unless these coaches are compensated for their time.[left]
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valleyball



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Join date : 2010-10-28

PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sun Mar 13, 2011 7:07 pm

DEAR Naismith


I am not a party to either side of this debate and only voicing a rational solution to the present program. My high school was also a volunteer and I also volunteer at my school.

Having a club system would still include those system but would allow ALL athletes a consistent development irrespective of where they lived.

In the present system we have, a loyal student athlete may attend a non traditional basketball school, and then realizes he has a passion for the sport, and wants to further his development. What flexibility is there in the current system to move, when at his present school the gym is never open or other players on his team are not committed. This player in grade 8 or 9 probably has more potential (height/athleticsm) at some players at a traditional school, but where does he get the Day to Day development. Yes he can atttend drive or 3d but we know it is not the same as getting in the gym everyday at 7 am or having an off season program or pick up ball every day.

In other sports at the highest level, the governing body ensures their are consistent levels of programming as it only further the sport. In high school basketball there is too much disparity and then we blame the kids or families for being ambitious when it is understand the 3-4 years of high school ball are so important.

So either create basketball focused schools in each demographic area in the province, so that the serious athlete can attend these schools, or ensure each triple a school presently playing at the highest level, provide your student athlete's the same programming.

Otherwise the process is so uneven and only hurts the development of the sport. Presently, an inspiring basketball player in grade 8 or 9 knows full well, staying at a non basketball school is fruitless and not forwarding his development, unless there was an outside club system which was much more important than high school ball.


From the OUTSIDE looking in, we are basically asking student athletes to accept the following

1) That high school basketball is the most important component to your development
2) That high school basketball is the primary vehicle for exposure to provincial teams and college acceptance
3) There is NO other competitive system outside of the current educational setup which can provide such development, competition and exposure on a daily, weekly basis during the school year WHICH is recognized and supported by Basketball BC
4) Yet, Mr. Student Athlete, though this is present system, we as the governing body or stakeholders, CANNOT assure of program quality or development for your future at your local school, as we are limiting your choices of transferring to a better program.
5) So your buddies who live in an other cathchment are only going to pass you as their school coach is more passionate, teammates more committed and have a basketball culture.
6) How does this present system ensure program quality IF we are going to stop the average student athlete from furthering their development as they understand High School Basketball is the ONLY entity out there

I would ask all stakeholders to kindly put their egos aside and just reflect on the present sytem. Either overhaul it entirely and make it club based or if high school basketball is the way, then ensure EACH passionate player has the same resources. Or create a system whereby there are so called super basketball high schools in each community at another (four A) level so that a student athlete can further their development with other like minded athletes.
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coach fabio



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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Sun Mar 13, 2011 7:37 pm

Say we overhaul the system and make it club based their is going to be even more kids not playing at the highest level.

For example in the "van west" their is VC, Churchill, Kits, and saints as the powerhouses and if their was a club team then only 3 or 4 kids from each school would make the "A" team meaning their would be many other quality players not playing the highest level. Making it club based is really just moving backwards.

I think the 4 tier system is the best, but schools should be tiered based on quality of progam not enrollment. A player should have the freedom to chose where he/she plays, because in the end it is all about the kids, right?

A club is not the way to go, keep it school based so kids can represent their respective schools!
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PostSubject: Re: new tiering proposal   Today at 1:05 am

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